Len McCluskey on the election: "The whingers and whiners say we didn't win. I say we

[Peter]

Also, Paul Mason has just tweeted this



He does remember what happened to Labour in the 1980s, right?

Honestly, p, as much as these people irritate me, they must make you absolutely despair.

Its very much part of the game. I like the fact that party retains a conscience and an eye for its history. It is of course very frustrating to have such muppets in charge.

[Burney]

Its very much part of the game. I like the fact that party retains a conscience and an eye for its history. It is of course very frustrating to have such muppets in charge.

There's an eye for history as you put it, and then there's misty-eyed nostalgia for a period of utter political impotence and widespread failure as a political party. The fact that people like Mason can even express a sentiment like that surely tells you they're more interested in ideologically-pure opposition than in gaining power and doing things.

And that's the real problem with seeing 2017 as a victory, of course. It sets a limit on your ambitions and tells everyone you don't ever really expect to actually win.

[Peter]

There's an eye for history as you put it, and then there's misty-eyed nostalgia for a period of utter political impotence and widespread failure as a political party. The fact that people like Mason can even express a sentiment like that surely tells you they're more interested in ideologically-pure opposition than in gaining power and doing things.

And that's the real problem with seeing 2017 as a victory, of course. It sets a limit on your ambitions and tells everyone you don't ever really expect to actually win.

Well, the real problem with seeing it as a victory is that they lost, but I take your point.

They will see the result as re-shaping the political debate and dismissing the notion that the electorate should never be presented with a left wing manifesto. They also see it as a huge victory within the party, which it is.

Going forward, it is dangerous. I would like another election sooner rather than later.