So it's another referendum then. Ignore Mrs May's firm assertion that there will

[Peter]

Blair has said with a straight face that he wouldn't rule out a third referendum in such a case. That's the sort of people we're dealing with here. The public vote means nothing to them unless it delivers the result they want. Gobshítes.

Mind you, if a Remain vote were returned, it would be fascinating to hear the reasons given as to why a third vote shouldn't be allowed.

That surely is the biggest practical argument against a second vote, leaving aside the whole 'you dont get a second chance just because you lost' thing. A leave victory changes nothing, a remain victory would solve nothing, and simply make it 1-1.

To be fair to Farage I think he said it might be worth it just to shut Blair up and the leave majority would be bigger. I dont think that is necessarily true and, as you have said, it certainly wouldn't shut anyone up.

The only scenario where a second vote could happen is if the vote was specifically on the exit deal, in the context of accepting that we are leaving whatever the outcome. That sounds pretty complicated so it cant really happen.

[redgunamo]

That surely is the biggest practical argument against a second vote, leaving aside the whole 'you dont get a second chance just because you lost' thing. A leave victory changes nothing, a remain victory would solve nothing, and simply make it 1-1.

To be fair to Farage I think he said it might be worth it just to shut Blair up and the leave majority would be bigger. I dont think that is necessarily true and, as you have said, it certainly wouldn't shut anyone up.

The only scenario where a second vote could happen is if the vote was specifically on the exit deal, in the context of accepting that we are leaving whatever the outcome. That sounds pretty complicated so it cant really happen.

Is everyone just playing for time now then? Maybe there'll eventually be no EU left to Brexit from?

[Burney]

Is everyone just playing for time now then? Maybe there'll eventually be no EU left to Brexit from?

The shenanigans with the Visegrád Group are going to get worse before they get better, which could mean more countries leaving. After all, I don't think the Poles, Slovaks, Czechs and Hungarians are likely to come around to the idea of mass muslim immigration any time soon.

[Burney]

That surely is the biggest practical argument against a second vote, leaving aside the whole 'you dont get a second chance just because you lost' thing. A leave victory changes nothing, a remain victory would solve nothing, and simply make it 1-1.

To be fair to Farage I think he said it might be worth it just to shut Blair up and the leave majority would be bigger. I dont think that is necessarily true and, as you have said, it certainly wouldn't shut anyone up.

The only scenario where a second vote could happen is if the vote was specifically on the exit deal, in the context of accepting that we are leaving whatever the outcome. That sounds pretty complicated so it cant really happen.

I think it would be touch and go as it was before. Sir John Curtice has made it clear that there has been no real shift in people's opinions since June 2016, so any vote would still be within the margin for error and thus too close to call.

A vote on the exit deal makes no sense. Your choice could only be between accepting the deal on the table or leaving with no deal at all. Either way, we leave.

[World's End Stella]

That surely is the biggest practical argument against a second vote, leaving aside the whole 'you dont get a second chance just because you lost' thing. A leave victory changes nothing, a remain victory would solve nothing, and simply make it 1-1.

To be fair to Farage I think he said it might be worth it just to shut Blair up and the leave majority would be bigger. I dont think that is necessarily true and, as you have said, it certainly wouldn't shut anyone up.

The only scenario where a second vote could happen is if the vote was specifically on the exit deal, in the context of accepting that we are leaving whatever the outcome. That sounds pretty complicated so it cant really happen.

I think there is an argument to be made that any referendum (forget Brexit specifically) is more likely to be representative if you have a second and final vote.

A single referendum is always open to the criticism that people didn't take it seriously because they thought it was certain that the public would vote one way or the other, or that something was fundamentally misrepresented in the lead up to the vote etc etc. A second referendum would resolve many of those concerns with necessarily leaving us open to the possibility of a third referendum.

I don't want one, of course, but I don't buy the argument that you can't have a second one without considering the possibility of a third one.

[Burney]

I think there is an argument to be made that any referendum (forget Brexit specifically) is more likely to be representative if you have a second and final vote.

A single referendum is always open to the criticism that people didn't take it seriously because they thought it was certain that the public would vote one way or the other, or that something was fundamentally misrepresented in the lead up to the vote etc etc. A second referendum would resolve many of those concerns with necessarily leaving us open to the possibility of a third referendum.

I don't want one, of course, but I don't buy the argument that you can't have a second one without considering the possibility of a third one.

The trouble with this argument (aparty from the bullshít about people not taking it seriously) is that it’s innately authoritarian. It smacks of teacher being able to tell the naughty electorate to go away and think about what it’s done and come back with the ‘right’ answer this time. In other words, it undermines the whole nature and purpose of the process.

[World's End Stella]

The trouble with this argument (aparty from the bullshít about people not taking it seriously) is that it’s innately authoritarian. It smacks of teacher being able to tell the naughty electorate to go away and think about what it’s done and come back with the ‘right’ answer this time. In other words, it undermines the whole nature and purpose of the process.

Why is 'not taking it seriously' bullsh1t? The 18-30 year old bracket was seriously under-represented on a proportional basis, you don't think that it is possible that they took for granted that we wouldn't Leave? I do, although I would agree they deserve everything they get if that was the reason.

You portray the approach as being similar to a teacher and a naughty child but that's just a frivolous analogy meant to demean the approach. The reality is that some of the issues with a single referendum could be addressed with a second referendum without leading to a possible third referendum. That's my utterly irrelevant point.

[Burney]

Why is 'not taking it seriously' bullsh1t? The 18-30 year old bracket was seriously under-represented on a proportional basis, you don't think that it is possible that they took for granted that we wouldn't Leave? I do, although I would agree they deserve everything they get if that was the reason.

You portray the approach as being similar to a teacher and a naughty child but that's just a frivolous analogy meant to demean the approach. The reality is that some of the issues with a single referendum could be addressed with a second referendum without leading to a possible third referendum. That's my utterly irrelevant point.

People who don't vote and then don't like the result don't get to turn around and have another go, ffs. That's rewarding voter apathy, ffs!

[redgunamo]

That surely is the biggest practical argument against a second vote, leaving aside the whole 'you dont get a second chance just because you lost' thing. A leave victory changes nothing, a remain victory would solve nothing, and simply make it 1-1.

Do it like in the football; two legs, aggregate score and all that?