Labour's attempts to differentiate their position on Brexit and specifically

[Peter]

We don't vote for PMs, we vote for MPs. I have no problem with continuity PMs like May and Brown leading their parties without winning a GE. Do Parliament get consulted in any meaningful way when EU bills become UK law?

However flawed UK democracy might be it is at least more democratic than the EU. Magna Carta was a long way from universal suffrage but it was still an improvement on absolute monarchy.

We don't conform to most modern (18th century onwards) interpretations of democracy. No separation of church and state, unelected Head of State, mangled unelected executive that is drawn directly from the legislature, unelected second chamber with significant, historical legal functions, no codified constitution, antiquated voting system....

On the plus side we get to directly elect the people who organise the binmen and street lighting, and we now have a Mayor of Birmingham….

[Burney]

We don't conform to most modern (18th century onwards) interpretations of democracy. No separation of church and state, unelected Head of State, mangled unelected executive that is drawn directly from the legislature, unelected second chamber with significant, historical legal functions, no codified constitution, antiquated voting system....

On the plus side we get to directly elect the people who organise the binmen and street lighting, and we now have a Mayor of Birmingham….

No, because our democratic structures pre-date those concepts of democracy. What's more, they've proved fairly robust by virtue of their adaptability. Ultimately, that's the thing about the UK system: whatever it's theoretical flaws, it actually works remarkably well.

[Peter]

No, because our democratic structures pre-date those concepts of democracy. What's more, they've proved fairly robust by virtue of their adaptability. Ultimately, that's the thing about the UK system: whatever it's theoretical flaws, it actually works remarkably well.

Democracy is not about things working well, it is about the people getting what they deserve.

British democracy is about pragmatism, patronage and tradition. Of course it works well. Certainly for those in it.....

[Ash]

We don't conform to most modern (18th century onwards) interpretations of democracy. No separation of church and state, unelected Head of State, mangled unelected executive that is drawn directly from the legislature, unelected second chamber with significant, historical legal functions, no codified constitution, antiquated voting system....

On the plus side we get to directly elect the people who organise the binmen and street lighting, and we now have a Mayor of Birmingham….

Oh, I'm all for waving the monarchy off into the sunset and abolishing the house of Lords, but Queenie doesn't actually do anything really political. We're hardly a theocracy, at least not untill the Alans take over, and binmen are terribly important, don't you think? The only thing most of us really expect from our Local Authority to do well is take the damn rubbish away.

[Peter]

Oh, I'm all for waving the monarchy off into the sunset and abolishing the house of Lords, but Queenie doesn't actually do anything really political. We're hardly a theocracy, at least not untill the Alans take over, and binmen are terribly important, don't you think? The only thing most of us really expect from our Local Authority to do well is take the damn rubbish away.

I'm just saying..... we are quick to say that ours works in practice but that Brussels doesn't work in theory.

I care little for either. Governments don't actually make decisions anyway. We would be better off voting for the CEO of Lloyds or Google.