Click here for Arsenal FC news and reports

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 51

Thread: Brace yourselves: Bobby Ball gone.

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by WES View Post
    But I'm not suggesting we lock them or anyone else away, I'm suggesting we allow them to decide the risk they are prepared to take.

    And your moral perspective excludes the issues faced by people in the non-vulnerable category. Why is it bad to think about people in the way you describe but it's ok to ignore the impact of lockdown on mental health, domestic abuse, cancer patients etc etc ?

    My main issue with our approach to Covid is that we don't look at it holistically, we seem to care only about Covid statistics rather than the impact of lockdown generally.
    It doesn't exclude people in the non-vulnerable category at all, it simply takes the view that to present vulnerable people with the stark choice between significant risk of death from this virus or self-imposed isolation is pretty inhumane when it is within the power of the rest of us to do things to help mitigate that risk.
    I'm not a lockdown fanatic, but neither am I of the opinion that it is feasible or reasonable simply to return to the status quo ante and let the more vulnerable members of our society face that choice. If you're talking about a holistic approach, you can't have one without a rather more sophisticated approach to the most vulnerable than you have outlined.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    It doesn't exclude people in the non-vulnerable category at all, it simply takes the view that to present vulnerable people with the stark choice between significant risk of death from this virus or self-imposed isolation is pretty inhumane when it is within the power of the rest of us to do things to help mitigate that risk.
    I'm not a lockdown fanatic, but neither am I of the opinion that it is feasible or reasonable simply to return to the status quo ante and let the more vulnerable members of our society face that choice. If you're talking about a holistic approach, you can't have one without a rather more sophisticated approach to the most vulnerable than you have outlined.
    This is a parody, right?

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir C View Post
    How long before the hysterics have us in full lockdown again? My money's on a week from now. :rubshands:
    I am a bit confused. In March just before the lockdown everyone was normal then we had lockdown.

    Now we generally all wear masks and keep distancing and now it's rising again. Almost like these magical masks don't work.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Pat Vegas View Post
    I am a bit confused. In March just before the lockdown everyone was normal then we had lockdown.

    Now we generally all wear masks and keep distancing and now it's rising again. Almost like these magical masks don't work.
    'It's' rising because we're doing lots of testing.

    ICUs are as busy as usual. A few people are dying of respiratory disease. Like every year.

    People have lost their fúcking minds.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir C View Post
    This is a parody, right?
    With Covid, the risk of death per 1000 in the 70-79 category is 8 (approx 10 for males). Now if your chances of dying whenever you got into an aeroplane were 1 in 100, you'd call that a pretty significant risk of death, wouldn't you? It'd probably make you pretty wary of flying, no?

    So yes. 'Significant'.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir C View Post
    'It's' rising because we're doing lots of testing.

    ICUs are as busy as usual. A few people are dying of respiratory disease. Like every year.

    People have lost their fúcking minds.
    Exactly. I was watching the news last week and they said a hospital in Manchester was at 97% Capacity.
    I don't find this shocknig as I assume most hospitals in the UK are like this all the time anyway.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    Sure. I agree about the polls for what it's worth. And I think that to make those calculations regarding one's own personal risk are absolutely fine. But it's not just about the risk to yourself. You're also taking risks with other people's lives. And at that point your calculation of the risk to yourself ceases to be the only factor.
    While I agree with you, I do think WES has made some sensible and important points. The world is ****ed isn't it?

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    With Covid, the risk of death per 1000 in the 70-79 category is 8 (approx 10 for males). Now if your chances of dying whenever you got into an aeroplane were 1 in 100, you'd call that a pretty significant risk of death, wouldn't you? It'd probably make you pretty wary of flying, no?

    So yes. 'Significant'.
    Your analogy is mendacious. The risk isn't a 1 in ahundred chance of dying if you get in the aeroplane, your risk is 1 in a hundred of dying if the aeroplane crashes. As you well know, 1 in a 100 70-79 year olds haven't died because they left the house.

    The risk is infinitesimal.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Pat Vegas View Post
    Exactly. I was watching the news last week and they said a hospital in Manchester was at 97% Capacity.
    I don't find this shocknig as I assume most hospitals in the UK are like this all the time anyway.
    That's correct. Our hospitals customarily operate at or near capacity at all times.

    The point is that if there is a significant spike in ICU admissions, then you get over 100% capacity in no time at all - which neans that people are no longer receiving adequate care and significant numbers of preventable deaths start occurring very quickly.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Luis Anaconda View Post
    While I agree with you, I do think WES has made some sensible and important points. The world is ****ed isn't it?
    Of course. This is f@cking complicated stuff and literally nobody has 'got it right' because 'getting it right' in this context is a pipe dream. It's a constant weighing of negatives against one another while trying to retain basic humanitarian principles. I don't care what political perspective you come from, but I pity any government of any political shade that is faced with making these choices.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •