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I have now officially joined both Brexit campaigns. Cameron beware.
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That's not really a surprise, is it?
I saw this gem earlier, I can only hope you've not joined this bunch.
https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...42897300_o.jpg
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They've missed the fact that it will take at least 10 years to untangle all our laws etc after
Brexit? And don't expect VAT to go away either :****er:
I dread to think what such disruption would do to the markets and my Europe wide investments :throatcut:
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It will get Europe to sort itself out. The present form the EU has taken is unsustainable.
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Are you Europeanophobic Mo?
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Nope. I'm very European. I am EUphobic, in its current incarnation.
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fwiw I agree, but we need to be in and changing it
We're in a great position as we are, but we should be influencing things rather than standing around on the edges petulantly grumbling.
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It's almost flamboyantly unsubstantaited, isnt it?
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Haven't we tried? The EU is like a juggernaut driven by its huge and unaccountable bureaucracy and
other interest groups. Denning compared EU law to the tide coming in thorugh every estuary and the EU as a whole is like that. They pledge to do this or that but nothing diverts the move to try and create a huge, unmanageable federal state with a centralised, intolerant, unelected directorate running the show.
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No, we've essentially been focussed on getting a rebate for the last 30 years
Because that makes us look strong in the minds of op ed writers. We're the fifth largest economy in the world and our influence over our near neighbours should be far, far greater.
If we stay in we could really use this whole 'close call' business to our advantage by building a proper coalition in europe.
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Maybe a "no" vote will lead to such a scenario? "Yes" will be taken to mean business as usual.
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Have you missed the whole "living on an island" thing then?
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Exactly my position. Think the worse result - and a very possible one - is a narrow
victory to stay in, which leaves a government with a huge rump of its party disaffected attempting to change things but facing massive resistance from both sides. Pretty much like the last 30 years then
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No, you doofus, a no vote will mean we leave Europe
I'm all for weaning ourself off of the current debt/financial services-based economic model but this would hit the current model really hard without coming up with any sort of viable alternative first.
It's essentially the same as sacking your manager without knowing who to replace them with.
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That's Germans for you; it actually makes sense to them.
Understandably, I suppose.
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Silly analogy. That happens all the time and football is fine.
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No, i think the worse result is pretty much any out one
As I say, I'm far from that guy who bases every political decision on stockmarket values but this would be catastrophic for british business, for the pound and for our place in the world. It's a real shortcut to diminishing our influence in terms of soft and hard power the world over.
As we're negotiating from a position of exclusionist weakness, not to mention have virtually no manufacturing base, every trade deal will be a ******* to negotiate and we'll spend a generation in the wilderness, added to the one that's already spent the last ten years here. We'll see a massive brain drain and jobs will fly out of the country to other places almost immediately.
We've got a ridiculously good position, lets recognise that.
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I don't miss it at all - pain in the arse getting anywhere
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I dont really have an islander mentality though, too many do
We should be looking at a hanseatic model here.
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That's the point; you don't need to because .. you live on an island
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Yes, fair points. Probably should have said worst case scenario
for a "remain" result as the dissension and opposition will remain will a healthy sense of its own importance, hampering the government at every turn.
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Geography matters very little nowadays, I work as much with people in the US and India as I do here
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Sure, but isn't it ridiculous to expect Europeans to do things our way?
They all speak perfect English, for a start.
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Yes but Yerp will always be the tory bugbear
It's their version of Labours calling everyone else splitters/red tories/etc
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Europeans, yes, but we can't include the French in that
when has it ever been possible to get them to do anything our way?
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Yeah, it does; it informs the over-riding mentality of the people living there.
Which, in turn, informs the society, culture, laws, behaviour and so on.
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Don't be surprised if there isn't a negotiation which leads to a second referendum.
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Mind you, the current Labour leader - isn't he a bit of a Brexiter?
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Ah - the Irish model. I think that is a possibility
Maybe it will go to penalties
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No, JC's all about Yerp. Good man, JC
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They're fiercely independent, of course. As we are.
The Germans only tolerate them at the top table because they live in hope that some "German-ness" will eventually rub off on them.
The special friendship thing is an enormous fib. The EU cannot work without it though.
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It's not a Tory issue, everyone deserves a better-run Europe than what we have. Not just the tories.
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I'm not saying it is, just that your tories have always had a Yerp based fault line
Of course I want a better run europe, I also want a better government here.
I still think, on balance, we have more chance of a better run europe than a better run UK though. I dont feel like I have a say in either.
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Well, naturally, because it would be run by Germans.
Thing is, *you* wouldn't want to live in such a place. Not even Germans want to live in such a place but they have no choice because .. well, because they're Germans.
Why do you imagine they all learn English so well. So that, in the wider world, they can pass for civilised human beings. Or, to put it another way, ask yourself why you've never taken the trouble to learn their lingo.
