Let's forget about yesterday. Dwelling on that is not the answer.

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Originally Posted by PSRB

Lee Chapman :-(

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I was too young to fully appreciate just how bad he was :-)

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Originally Posted by Peter

I was too young to fully appreciate just how bad he was :-)

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Lucky you. He was truly woeful. Disliked him even more as he was with Leslie Ash (when she was fit)

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Originally Posted by PSRB

Lucky you. He was truly woeful. Disliked him even more as he was with Leslie Ash (when she was fit)

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Wasn?t she the daft bint who turned her face into a weather balloon ?

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Originally Posted by Peter

I think standards in the CL are lower than the premier league. We'll only really see the quality in the latter stages.

I know it isnt as simple as 'get 1-0 up and then destroy the game' but as a coach he must see that that is what is happening. He must see the lack of creativity, the drop in tempo, the lack of press. Either he doesn't care or he cant change it.

Either way, it doesn't reflect well on him :-(

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The data - I use that term loosely - that we don't have access to is what Arteta actually does with the team in training, and what his pre-match instructions are and what he tells them during the game.

Do we really think that Arteta doesn't have the players spend time practising passing through a press and moving the ball quickly into the final third? I've seen video of them practising the final third bit, it's hard to believe they haven't been trained in the bit before that.

And if that is the case and they are encouraged to do so and to express themselves (as Arteta did publicly recently), why does it all stop as soon as we go 1-0 up? Are they told to change the way they play at that point?

Too many questions we don't have answers to, Peter.

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Originally Posted by 7sisters

Wasn?t she the daft bint who turned her face into a weather balloon ?

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That's her, bit of a sort in MBB back in the day. Then had a friend's mother inject her lips and her face blew up :hehe:

Or something like that

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Originally Posted by WES

The data - I use that term loosely - that we don't have access to is what Arteta actually does with the team in training, and what his pre-match instructions are and what he tells them during the game.

Do we really think that Arteta doesn't have the players spend time practising passing through a press and moving the ball quickly into the final third? I've seen video of them practising the final third bit, it's hard to believe they haven't been trained in the bit before that.

And if that is the case and they are encouraged to do so and to express themselves (as Arteta did publicly recently), why does it all stop as soon as we go 1-0 up? Are they told to change the way they play at that point?

Too many questions we don't have answers to, Peter.

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I agree. But either way..... as I said, it's isnt a good look for him.

My hunch is that he still overloads players with instructions and information. And you look at him constantly shouting at them on the touchline. That probably doesn't help.

The more you attempt to script the game, the more you remove autonomy from the players. They become less responsive to situations in-game. Less willing to take risks.

I saw Arteta talking a few months ago and he was asked what he thinks his biggest intakes were in his first few years. He said focusing too much on the tactical side and not enough on the human and personal side.

Interesting.....

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Originally Posted by Peter

I agree. But either way..... as I said, it's isnt a good look for him.

My hunch is that he still overloads players with instructions and information. And you look at him constantly shouting at them on the touchline. That probably doesn't help.

The more you attempt to script the game, the more you remove autonomy from the players. They become less responsive to situations in-game. Less willing to take risks.

I saw Arteta talking a few months ago and he was asked what he thinks his biggest intakes were in his first few years. He said focusing too much on the tactical side and not enough on the human and personal side.

Interesting.....

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Always going to be an issue with an inexperienced coach; the instinct to try to do too much, ask too many questions, instead of sometimes just letting it all work out, to borrow a phrase. After all, his players have more experience of playing football than he does of managing football teams. They already know what they're supposed to be doing, they are competent and conscientious professionals. Perhaps the way they keep them engaged is by constantly giving them new, interesting things to think about; corners, throw-ins maybe. Inverted midfielders.

Back in the day, Big Ron was asked, what's your biggest problem as manager. He said it's that, despite being in his fifties, he was still the best centre forward at the club, the best headerer of a football. Banter, of course, but the truth behind it, the managers' thinking is, these idle, fractious, drunken morons are going to get me sacked unless I keep them under my thumb at all times; they already did for the last bloke, after all. All the time and resources in the world and they can't even learn to head the ball properly :-\

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Originally Posted by redgunamo

Always going to be an issue with an inexperienced coach; the instinct to try to do too much, ask too many questions, instead of sometimes just letting it all work out, to borrow a phrase. After all, his players have more experience of playing football than he does of managing football teams. They already know what they're supposed to be doing, they are competent and conscientious professionals. Perhaps the way they keep them engaged is by constantly giving them new, interesting things to think about; corners, throw-ins maybe. Inverted midfielders.

Back in the day, Big Ron was asked, what's your biggest problem as manager. He said it's that, despite being in his fifties, he was still the best centre forward at the club, the best headerer of a football. Banter, of course, but the truth behind it, the managers' thinking is, these idle, fractious, drunken morons are going to get me sacked unless I keep them under my thumb at all times; they already did for the last bloke, after all. All the time and resources in the world and they can't even learn to head the ball properly :-\

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True. George was the same. Although bar Alan Smith, he probably was still the best header of a ball at the club.

But George knew something that our current management team dont- hear me out on this one....! :-)

If you are going to ask a player to perform a limited, well-scripted role and do exactly what they are told, you are better off using limited players.

George didnt want the geniuses. They get bored and go off script. He wanted younger players, great professionals, and players who were good at certain things. Kevin Richardson instead of Steve Williams. Perry Groves instead of Charlie Nicholas. Michael Thomas instead of Viv Anderson. Lee Dixon instead of... well, anybody.

Maybe our current players are too good......

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Originally Posted by Peter

True. George was the same. Although bar Alan Smith, he probably was still the best header of a ball at the club.

But George knew something that our current management team dont- hear me out on this one....! :-)

If you are going to ask a player to perform a limited, well-scripted role and do exactly what they are told, you are better off using limited players.

George didnt want the geniuses. They get bored and go off script. He wanted younger players, great professionals, and players who were good at certain things. Kevin Richardson instead of Steve Williams. Perry Groves instead of Charlie Nicholas. Michael Thomas instead of Viv Anderson. Lee Dixon instead of... well, anybody.

Maybe our current players are too good......

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Good point. They're certainly too expensive, some say. Not me.

Talking of Richardsons, Richie once said, a professional player must always play within himself. Meaning, we already know you've got all the shots; that's why you're here. We do not need to see them all whenever you're out in the middle. No, what we want from you now is an innings, lots of runs.

Discipline is a skill too, I guess. Anyway, results, trophies, are harder to come by without it. Just because you select a chap who can shoot from the halfway line, it doesn't mean you want him doing it every five minutes.

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Originally Posted by redgunamo

Good point. They're certainly too expensive, some say. Not me.

Talking of Richardsons, Richie once said, a professional player must always play within himself. Meaning, we already know you've got all the shots; that's why you're here. We do not need to see them all whenever you're out in the middle. No, what we want from you now is an innings, lots of runs.

Discipline is a skill too, I guess. Anyway, results, trophies, are harder to come by without it. Just because you select a chap who can shoot from the halfway line, it doesn't mean you want him doing it every five minutes.

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Exactly. But there are limits.

If you want disciplined cricketers who do what they are told, dont pick Kevin Pieterson. Or Brian Lara, for that matter. They are too good. And they know it. Nothing you ask of them will be more effective than who they are. And discipline isnt a big part of their skill set.

Dennis left Inter because they wanted him to play with his back to goal. He tried to explain that he wasnt Alan Smith. So he moved to a club who wanted him to be Dennis.

You dont tell Dennis how to play football any more than you tell Joe Root how to play spin. Perfection is too rare in life to be tampered with.

All of this is a long-winded way of saying we should have stuck with Eddie Nketiah..... :-)