You do realise that it's currently the equivalent of October 1914

[Sir C]

and we're sliding inexorably into a world war, don't you?

It's strange how calm and accepting everyone is.

Pucker up your árseholes, boys. It's armageddon for us all.

[Rich]

and we're sliding inexorably into a world war, don't you?

It's strange how calm and accepting everyone is.

Pucker up your árseholes, boys. It's armageddon for us all.

Do you not think Trump may be bluffing? I'd have thought he'd have struck by now.

Apparently May is going to contribute 1 x RAF Voyager for air to air refueling :hehe:

Also, Putin isn't going to shoot an F-22 out of the sky because 1) he doesn't have the minerals and 2) because he doesn't have the resources to do so.

[Alberto Balsam Rodriguez]

and we're sliding inexorably into a world war, don't you?

It's strange how calm and accepting everyone is.

Pucker up your árseholes, boys. It's armageddon for us all.


Are you speaking from memory?

[Tony C]

Was looking at some odds over the weekend and stumbled across - Donald Trump tonwin a Nobel Peace Prize @ 6/4.

Awfully short unless they hand it out like knighthoods imo

[Sir C]

Are you speaking from memory?

How very rude.

I'm surprised at you, a. Surprised, and a little disappointed.

[Pat Vegas]

and we're sliding inexorably into a world war, don't you?

It's strange how calm and accepting everyone is.

Pucker up your árseholes, boys. It's armageddon for us all.

Not in my world Sir C. I am ignorant to current affairs :cloud9:
if it does kick off can you let me know

[Burney]

and we're sliding inexorably into a world war, don't you?

It's strange how calm and accepting everyone is.

Pucker up your árseholes, boys. It's armageddon for us all.

I'm pretty sure they'd finished sliding inexorably into war by October 1914, hadn't they? The Guns of August and all that?

[Sir C]

I'm pretty sure they'd finished sliding inexorably into war by October 1914, hadn't they? The Guns of August and all that?

Good point. I have November in my head, clearly.

I wonder whether a thermo-nuclear device exploding above London at 3 a.m. would wake me up?

[Burney]

Good point. I have November in my head, clearly.

I wonder whether a thermo-nuclear device exploding above London at 3 a.m. would wake me up?

Nobody starts wars in November. Weather's too dreadful. In fact, it could be argued that the Germans had already effectively lost the war by October 1914. It just took them four years to realise it.

When it comes to thermonuclear devices, I'm not sure where I stand these days. When one lived in London, one could at least be fairly certain you'd at least die in the blast rather than a lingering death from radiation sickness and whatnot. Now I don't know.

[Peter]

Nobody starts wars in November. Weather's too dreadful. In fact, it could be argued that the Germans had already effectively lost the war by October 1914. It just took them four years to realise it.

When it comes to thermonuclear devices, I'm not sure where I stand these days. When one lived in London, one could at least be fairly certain you'd at least die in the blast rather than a lingering death from radiation sickness and whatnot. Now I don't know.

True. War should always be declared in favourable weather. Hitler declared war on the US in a December. Silly boy......

[Sir C]

Nobody starts wars in November. Weather's too dreadful. In fact, it could be argued that the Germans had already effectively lost the war by October 1914. It just took them four years to realise it.

When it comes to thermonuclear devices, I'm not sure where I stand these days. When one lived in London, one could at least be fairly certain you'd at least die in the blast rather than a lingering death from radiation sickness and whatnot. Now I don't know.

The radiation stuff is all lefty propaganda, apparently. I read about it a couple of years ago. According to this random article on the internet, if the effects of radiation were as severe as we are led to believe, about half a million people would have died of cancer in the years following Chernobyl. The actual number of cases was about 17. These numbers may not be 100% accurate, but you get the gist.

[Burney]

True. War should always be declared in favourable weather. Hitler declared war on the US in a December. Silly boy......

Well yes. But he wasn't actually planning any land-based military operations against them when he did so.

With hindsight, you really do have to wonder what on earth he was thinking. He wasn't obliged to declare war against them, after all, the lunatic.

[Burney]

The radiation stuff is all lefty propaganda, apparently. I read about it a couple of years ago. According to this random article on the internet, if the effects of radiation were as severe as we are led to believe, about half a million people would have died of cancer in the years following Chernobyl. The actual number of cases was about 17. These numbers may not be 100% accurate, but you get the gist.

I have read similar, actually. The dangers of Chernobyl were massively exaggerated - mostly by German greens and similar who wanted to demonise nuclear power in all its guises.

[PSRB]

I have read similar, actually. The dangers of Chernobyl were massively exaggerated - mostly by German greens and similar who wanted to demonise nuclear power in all its guises.

***ishima, seems to be similar. Granted it's been a much shorter period of time, but bar the mad *******s that actually went in to cap the thing, there appears not to have been any significant cancer increase

[Burney]

***ishima, seems to be similar. Granted it's mean a much shorter period of time, but bar the mad *******s that actually went in to cap the thing, there appears not to have been any significant cancer increase

Didn't a bunch of old people volunteer to do that in Japan on the grounds that they'd had their innings and it made sense.

I think we should do this with our elderly. Give them really dangerous jobs in return for a one-off payment for their families. It would solve the pensions crisis at a stroke.

[PSRB]

Do you not think Trump may be bluffing? I'd have thought he'd have struck by now.

Apparently May is going to contribute 1 x RAF Voyager for air to air refueling :hehe:

Also, Putin isn't going to shoot an F-22 out of the sky because 1) he doesn't have the minerals and 2) because he doesn't have the resources to do so.

Well, with his latest Twitter outburst I rather suspect that the bluffing option has been defenestrated!

""Russia vows to shoot down any and all missiles fired at Syria. Get ready Russia, because they will be coming, nice and new and “smart!” You shouldn’t be partners with a Gas Killing Animal who kills his people and enjoys it!""

[Burney]

Well, with his latest Twitter outburst I rather suspect that the bluffing option has been defenestrated!

""Russia vows to shoot down any and all missiles fired at Syria. Get ready Russia, because they will be coming, nice and new and “smart!” You shouldn’t be partners with a Gas Killing Animal who kills his people and enjoys it!""

The Donald has realised - as Lord Palmerston did 150 years before him - that "The policy and practice of the Russian Government has always been to push forward its encroachments as fast and as far as the apathy or want of firmness of other Governments would allow it to go, but always to stop and retire when it met with decided resistance and then to wait for the next favourable opportunity."

[Alberto Balsam Rodriguez]

How very rude.

I'm surprised at you, a. Surprised, and a little disappointed.


You did sort of walk into that one, c.

[Luis Anaconda]

You did sort of walk into that one, c.

Still nor fair to mock an old man, though, a

[Peter]

Well yes. But he wasn't actually planning any land-based military operations against them when he did so.

With hindsight, you really do have to wonder what on earth he was thinking. He wasn't obliged to declare war against them, after all, the lunatic.

I think he was thinking ahead. He wanted greater cooperation with Japan as he saw them as a potential help against the Soviet Union at some point. More importantly, he believed, correctly, that the USA would now inevitably enter the war and declare war on Germany. Most leaders prefer that, to show they were provoked. Hitler didnt give a fuclk and wanted to get in there first, partly to show Japan he was serious.

THis wasnt his big mistake, not really. THat was invading the Soviet Union in June. Had he done that in March/april he might have had a slight of establishing control and a firm base before winter fell. Doing it in June meant that Stalin simply needed to pull back and wait.

Once the tide turned in the eastern war Hitler was dead and buried.

[Peter]

The Donald has realised - as Lord Palmerston did 150 years before him - that "The policy and practice of the Russian Government has always been to push forward its encroachments as fast and as far as the apathy or want of firmness of other Governments would allow it to go, but always to stop and retire when it met with decided resistance and then to wait for the next favourable opportunity."

Which is also, pretty much to the letter, Hitler's foreign policy up until 1939. Its just that he didnt actually meet any resistance until then....

It isnt a bad description of everyone's foreign policy......

[Rich]

The Donald has realised - as Lord Palmerston did 150 years before him - that "The policy and practice of the Russian Government has always been to push forward its encroachments as fast and as far as the apathy or want of firmness of other Governments would allow it to go, but always to stop and retire when it met with decided resistance and then to wait for the next favourable opportunity."

So we need to bring Putin to his knees just like we did the USSR?*

* Economically speaking, at least.

[Burney]

I think he was thinking ahead. He wanted greater cooperation with Japan as he saw them as a potential help against the Soviet Union at some point. More importantly, he believed, correctly, that the USA would now inevitably enter the war and declare war on Germany. Most leaders prefer that, to show they were provoked. Hitler didnt give a fuclk and wanted to get in there first, partly to show Japan he was serious.

THis wasnt his big mistake, not really. THat was invading the Soviet Union in June. Had he done that in March/april he might have had a slight of establishing control and a firm base before winter fell. Doing it in June meant that Stalin simply needed to pull back and wait.

Once the tide turned in the eastern war Hitler was dead and buried.

Only a fool could have imagined the Japanese would be in a position to help with Russia once they had triggered war with the mightiest economy on earth. Besides, the Russians were able to work out in winter 1941 that the Japs had no plans to attack Russia (allowing them to transfer huge numbers of troops from Siberia to the Moscow front and throw the Germans back), so how come their allies the Germans weren't privy to the same information?
And sure, war between Germany and the US was inevitable in the long run, but to trigger it when he didn't have to was still remarkably hubristic. Not least because it ensured the supply of massive, war-winning amounts of food and materiel to the Russians by the US that might otherwise not have happened so early.

As far as Russia was concerned, I think invading at all with the notion of conquering the whole bloody place was the real mistake. The Russians fighting on home soil can always trade space and lives for time and still be able to come back at you. Germany catastrophically underestimated the Russian capacity to resist - particularly in what was in effect a war of annihilation. Germany never had the resources to fight such a war to a successful conclusion.

[Burney]

So we need to bring Putin to his knees just like we did the USSR?*

* Economically speaking, at least.

Not really. He isn't a serious global threat in the sense that the USSR was. He's simply a posturing strong man type who needs to be made to wind his fvcking neck in.

Never forget when talking about Russia and its capabilities that - for all its geographical size - Russia's economy is less than half the size of the UK's. Russia's economic capacity for doing anything much more than posturing in military terms is virtually zero.

[eastgermanautos]

The radiation stuff is all lefty propaganda, apparently. I read about it a couple of years ago. According to this random article on the internet, if the effects of radiation were as severe as we are led to believe, about half a million people would have died of cancer in the years following Chernobyl. The actual number of cases was about 17. These numbers may not be 100% accurate, but you get the gist.

Well, sure, but you get a lot of two-headed birds within the perimeter.

[Peter]

Only a fool could have imagined the Japanese would be in a position to help with Russia once they had triggered war with the mightiest economy on earth. Besides, the Russians were able to work out in winter 1941 that the Japs had no plans to attack Russia (allowing them to transfer huge numbers of troops from Siberia to the Moscow front and throw the Germans back), so how come their allies the Germans weren't privy to the same information?
And sure, war between Germany and the US was inevitable in the long run, but to trigger it when he didn't have to was still remarkably hubristic. Not least because it ensured the supply of massive, war-winning amounts of food and materiel to the Russians by the US that might otherwise not have happened so early.

As far as Russia was concerned, I think invading at all with the notion of conquering the whole bloody place was the real mistake. The Russians fighting on home soil can always trade space and lives for time and still be able to come back at you. Germany catastrophically underestimated the Russian capacity to resist - particularly in what was in effect a war of annihilation. Germany never had the resources to fight such a war to a successful conclusion.

Quite simply, he didnt have the numbers to hold gains in the East and defend the Western front against what was undoubtedly coming at some point. Alliance with the Soviet Union was the only plausible route to victory here but ideologygotin the way of that. In no way could he have justified that in he long term. THe entire premise demanded a mass of territorial gains in the East, and not just Poland and their ilk.

In effect, he had to attack Russia and you are right, it had to be a war of annihilation which was never, ever going to happen. He massively underestimated the resolve of the russian soldier.

His view of how Japan could help is an odd one. Aside from assistance to the east of Russia they could help in two ways- distract/cripple the US navy to delay or prevent the opening of a western front, and something similar towards the British in the East, further crippling our resource and resolve. They tried both, with some success, but only to delay. THat kind of assistance required totalvictoryin Russia which never came. To be fair, they got closer than most.

[Peter]

Not really. He isn't a serious global threat in the sense that the USSR was. He's simply a posturing strong man type who needs to be made to wind his fvcking neck in.

Never forget when talking about Russia and its capabilities that - for all its geographical size - Russia's economy is less than half the size of the UK's. Russia's economic capacity for doing anything much more than posturing in military terms is virtually zero.

THat is pretty much what Hitler said in 1941 :)

Never attack the Russians. Never ends well......

[Burney]

Which is also, pretty much to the letter, Hitler's foreign policy up until 1939. Its just that he didnt actually meet any resistance until then....

It isnt a bad description of everyone's foreign policy......

Which, of course, is an endorsement of the idea of pushing back against Putin as Trump is doing and as Obama singularly failed to do.

It's certainly a description of the foreign policy of expansionist powers. There aren't many such powers left, however - at least in the West. Russia has always been that sort of power because it perceives itself as having a sphere of influence and control far beyond its borders that includes nebulous ethnic (ie Slavic) and religious (ie Orthodox) components. In addition, being where it is, Russia has always had a massive chip on its shoulder because it is seen (justifiably) as backward and uncivilised by its western European neighbours. This inferiority complex has made it aggressive in its dealings with those neighbours and its relationships with them uncomfortable.

[Burney]

THat is pretty much what Hitler said in 1941 :)

Never attack the Russians. Never ends well......

Oh, never invade Russia with the intention of defeating it utterly. That is madness. However, it's perfectly possible to fight local wars with limited objectives with Russia (Crimea, Russo-Japanese War, etc, etc) and win. Plus, of course, the Russian home record is pretty decent (if Pyrrhic), but their away record is absolutely shocking.

[Luis Anaconda]

Oh, never invade Russia with the intention of defeating it utterly. That is madness. However, it's perfectly possible to fight local wars with limited objectives with Russia (Crimea, Russo-Japanese War, etc, etc) and win. Plus, of course, the Russian home record is pretty decent (if Pyrrhic), but their away record is absolutely shocking.

In light of our match on Thursday, this has me worried :(

[Burney]

In light of our match on Thursday, this has me worried :(

Yes, but we have limited objectives, la. We need to get in and get out without conceding more than two goals and/or scoring at least one ourselves. All we need to do is not lose too badly and we're fine.

[PSRB]

Yes, but we have limited objectives, la. We need to get in and get out without conceding more than two goals and/or scoring at least one ourselves. All we need to do is not lose too badly and we're fine.

It's an aged and crumbling defensive line, we should be able to breakthrough with impunity. Victoria Concordia, etc

[Peter]

Oh, never invade Russia with the intention of defeating it utterly. That is madness. However, it's perfectly possible to fight local wars with limited objectives with Russia (Crimea, Russo-Japanese War, etc, etc) and win. Plus, of course, the Russian home record is pretty decent (if Pyrrhic), but their away record is absolutely shocking.

Without question, they dount travel well. If you are going to war with russia you need to make sure it is fought over two legs.

[Burney]

It's an aged and crumbling defensive line, we should be able to breakthrough with impunity. Victoria Concordia, etc

:nod: "You only have to kick in the door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down" - Adolf Hitler, 1941

[Peter]

Yes, but we have limited objectives, la. We need to get in and get out without conceding more than two goals and/or scoring at least one ourselves. All we need to do is not lose too badly and we're fine.

And we are going in spring.

[Peter]

:nod: "You only have to kick in the door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down" - Adolf Hitler, 1941

He did and it didnt. The whole rotten structure came down very heavily on his head.

[World's End Stella]

Yes, but we have limited objectives, la. We need to get in and get out without conceding more than two goals and/or scoring at least one ourselves. All we need to do is not lose too badly and we're fine.

We're going the way of Napoleon and Hitler with Aaron Ramsey? :-(

[Luis Anaconda]

Yes, but we have limited objectives, la. We need to get in and get out without conceding more than two goals and/or scoring at least one ourselves. All we need to do is not lose too badly and we're fine.

Phew - now can you assure me those scouse ****s won’t win the big one

[Alberto Balsam Rodriguez]

Still nor fair to mock an old man, though, a


Well, Nicosia has fvcked off so we have to adjust, la

[barrybueno]

and we're sliding inexorably into a world war, don't you?

It's strange how calm and accepting everyone is.

Pucker up your árseholes, boys. It's armageddon for us all.

ooh in just under 11 years Herbert Chapman joins The Arsenal, that's something to look forward to innit?