So what's the opinion on the people who were subletting their flats at Grenfell Tower

[Pat Vegas]

discuss 10 characters

[Billy Goat Sverige]

discuss 10 characters

Should be prosecuted. ****ing dumb to let them get away with it.

[Pat Vegas]

Should be prosecuted. ****ing dumb to let them get away with it.

any other illegal landlord would get done if their place burned down with the tenants inside.

They should also be removed from any housing list.

[Billy Goat Sverige]

any other illegal landlord would get done if their place burned down with the tenants inside.

They should also be removed from any housing list.

The whole point of social housing is you're given it at subsidised rent because you can't afford housing otherwise, and then these ****s go and rent it out at probably double what they pay.

[Burney]

The whole point of social housing is you're given it at subsidised rent because you can't afford housing otherwise, and then these ****s go and rent it out at probably double what they pay.

The amnesty for sub-letting landlords is an utter disgrace and makes a mockery of the law. However, the real point of it is that the authorities a/ need to know how many people were in the flats and b/ know that any attempt to prosecute anyone at all who appears to be any sort of a resident of Grenfell (even if they were actually illegally sub-letting) will be portrayed as an act of barbarism by the left, will be met with howls of outrage and will be cynically exploited for political gain.

[Pat Vegas]

The whole point of social housing is you're given it at subsidised rent because you can't afford housing otherwise, and then these ****s go and rent it out at probably double what they pay.

I can't work out how it works though. Won't they have to pay to live somewhere else?
or do they just sneak into a family members place and stay there and get free monies.

[IUFG]

The amnesty for sub-letting landlords is an utter disgrace and makes a mockery of the law. However, the real point of it is that the authorities a/ need to know how many people were in the flats and b/ know that any attempt to prosecute anyone at all who appears to be any sort of a resident of Grenfell (even if they were actually illegally sub-letting) will be portrayed as an act of barbarism by the left, will be met with howls of outrage and will be cynically exploited for political gain.

they have bottled out of prosecuting anyone solely because of the left have turned an absolute tragedy into a political hot potato.

[Billy Goat Sverige]

I can't work out how it works though. Won't they have to pay to live somewhere else?
or do they just sneak into a family members place and stay there and get free monies.

Someone letting out one of those flats could probably rent somewhere outside of london and make a nice profit. Or they could be living with family members like you said.

[Burney]

they have bottled out of prosecuting anyone solely because of the left have turned an absolute tragedy into a political hot potato.

Basically, yes. They know that prosecuting some Pakistani bloke who's illegally sublet his flat to a dangerous and unsafe number of people who may well not even be legal migrants will be represented as racist persecution of a 'victim' and yet more evidence of how evil and racist the authorities are. You have to remember that the Labour Party is now run by actual Bolsheviks who see any possibility of civil unrest or disruption as an opportunity to seek power. That is how they think.

[Ash]

they have bottled out of prosecuting anyone solely because of the left have turned an absolute tragedy into a political hot potato.

It is a political scandal, though. After 1666 London became pretty focused on constructing buildings out of non-flammable materials. Now this happens. Whether it was penny-pinching, as some claim, trying to have better insulation for C02 targets, as others claim, or trying to keep residents warm, as other others claim, is worth finding out tbf.

If Labour are making hay out of this they should be careful though, having just turfed the inhabitants of three blocks in Camden out on the street.

[Burney]

It is a political scandal, though. After 1666 London became pretty focused on constructing buildings out of non-flammable materials. Now this happens. Whether it was penny-pinching, as some claim, trying to have better insulation for C02 targets, as others claim, or trying to keep residents warm, as other others claim, is worth finding out tbf.

If Labour are making hay out of this they should be careful though, having just turfed the inhabitants of three blocks in Camden out on the street.

It's only a political scandal in the sense that politicians are ultimately responsible for social housing. What it is not, however, is a party political scandal. As you say, Labour boroughs seem to be equally culpable in terms of the type of cladding used and it is simply luck that this happened under a Tory council. What Labour are clearly trying to do, however, is frame this in terms of 'Evil Tories murder poor, brown people' with the apparent intention of promoting civil unrest. That is the purest bullshït, as well as being monstrously cynical and irresponsible.

[Monty92]

It's only a political scandal in the sense that politicians are ultimately responsible for social housing. What it is not, however, is a party political scandal. As you say, Labour boroughs seem to be equally culpable in terms of the type of cladding used and it is simply luck that this happened under a Tory council. What Labour are clearly trying to do, however, is frame this in terms of 'Evil Tories murder poor, brown people' with the apparent intention of promoting civil unrest. That is the purest bullshït and monstrously cynical and irresponsible.

The problem is, now that Labour have been taken over by the hard left, they are much more easily able to distance themselves from the party of yesteryear. So they can claim that all of these terrible decisions were made in the bad old days when the Labour party was infested with red Tories and that *this* Labour party will not allow such gross negligence by local authorities to take place ever again.

And as we have seen, people will swallow it.

[Burney]

The problem is, now that Labour have been taken over by the hard left, they are much more easily able to distance themselves from the party of yesteryear. So they can claim that all of these terrible decisions were made in the bad old days when the Labour party was infested with red Tories and that *this* Labour party will not allow such gross negligence by local authorities to take place ever again.

And as we have seen, people will swallow it.

I do wonder how much people are actually swallowing, though. I think there are a lot of voters out there who were probably quite scared by how close they came to creating a Corbyn government and will be unlikely to make that mistake again.

[Ash]

The problem is, now that Labour have been taken over by the hard left, they are much more easily able to distance themselves from the party of yesteryear. So they can claim that all of these terrible decisions were made in the bad old days when the Labour party was infested with red Tories and that *this* Labour party will not allow such gross negligence by local authorities to take place ever again.

And as we have seen, people will swallow it.

You're getting good at this handwringing routine. :hehe:

Now, is there a For Sale sign outside Mezut's house yet?

[Ash]

handwringing

Maybe pearl-clutching would have been a better description tbf.

[Burney]

Maybe pearl-clutching would have been a better description tbf.

Handwringing deffo sounded a bit anti-semitic to me. ;-)

[Monty92]

I do wonder how much people are actually swallowing, though. I think there are a lot of voters out there who were probably quite scared by how close they came to creating a Corbyn government and will be unlikely to make that mistake again.

As always, I hope you're right. But I fear you overplay the extent to which voters are influenced by "fear". I think only a small number vote on such visceral grounds. The big concern is that Labour, much like Trump, have managed to create a political climate in which voting for an outsider who doesn't look or sound like your average politician, feels fun and exciting. And we don't know how much more that can be pushed.

I worry about how many friends of friends will be co-erced into voting for Corbyn next time round. Granted, many of these will be in safe Labour seats, but we simply don't know how far this style of campaigning can go.

[Sir C]

Basically, yes. They know that prosecuting some Pakistani bloke who's illegally sublet his flat to a dangerous and unsafe number of people who may well not even be legal migrants will be represented as racist persecution of a 'victim' and yet more evidence of how evil and racist the authorities are. You have to remember that the Labour Party is now run by actual Bolsheviks who see any possibility of civil unrest or disruption as an opportunity to seek power. That is how they think.

They're definitely pushing the 'murdering Tories' idea, and pushing it hard. It's clear that the intention is o produce a febrile atmosphere, just ripe for Momentum to let the SWP hordes off the leash, as well as Lammy working on the residents of Tottenham to get out and hack a copper's head off.

[Monty92]

You're getting good at this handwringing routine. :hehe:

Now, is there a For Sale sign outside Mezut's house yet?

I'll check in about an hour.

[Sir C]

As always, I hope you're right. But I fear you overplay the extent to which voters are influenced by "fear". I think only a small number vote on such visceral grounds. The big concern is that Labour, much like Trump, have managed to create a political climate in which voting for an outsider who doesn't look or sound like your average politician, feels fun and exciting. And we don't know how much more that can be pushed.

I worry about how many friends of friends will be co-erced into voting for Corbyn next time round. Granted, many of these will be in safe Labour seats, but we simply don't know how far this style of campaigning can go.

Our main hope must be that the Tories can't get it so wildly wrong again next time. Surely!

[Burney]

As always, I hope you're right. But I fear you overplay the extent to which voters are influenced by "fear". I think only a small number vote on such visceral grounds. The big concern is that Labour, much like Trump, have managed to create a political climate in which voting for an outsider who doesn't look or sound like your average politician, feels fun and exciting. And we don't know how much more that can be pushed.

I worry about how many friends of friends will be co-erced into voting for Corbyn next time round. Granted, many of these will be in safe Labour seats, but we simply don't know how far this style of campaigning can go.

My suspicion is that a confident, Corbyn-led Labour Party will become increasingly off-putting, since it will start to show its very ugly side as it starts to look less bumbling and more sinister.

[Burney]

They're definitely pushing the 'murdering Tories' idea, and pushing it hard. It's clear that the intention is o produce a febrile atmosphere, just ripe for Momentum to let the SWP hordes off the leash, as well as Lammy working on the residents of Tottenham to get out and hack a copper's head off.

They've already sent activists to smash up Kensington and Chelsea town hall under the guise of them being distraught residents. This is what the left, red in tooth and claw, is like. People have forgotten.

[Pokster]

they have bottled out of prosecuting anyone solely because of the left have turned an absolute tragedy into a political hot potato.

Do you really think that :rolleyes: They won't prosecute as it is impossible to say who was illegally sub letting as most of them are dead.... they want to try to find out who died and what number died, they can't do that if they don't find out who was in the flats, they can't do that if the legal renters won't say as they will be prosecuted.

It's usual tosh, "they won't prosecute because of the left winf etc etc"... council is Tory, Govt is Tory so it is their decision not to prosecute.

[Pokster]

I do wonder how much people are actually swallowing, though. I think there are a lot of voters out there who were probably quite scared by how close they came to creating a Corbyn government and will be unlikely to make that mistake again.

I thought you weren't ever going to make election predictions again??

[IUFG]

Do you really think that :rolleyes:

I do. I think Berni clarified it better as "party political'.

[Pokster]

I do. I think Berni clarified it better as "party political'.

imho, what a load of *******s. They want to know how many people died, unless they know who were in the flats they can't do that. the only way they can find out is by getting the rightful tenants to admit who was actually living there.