It's not so much that he doesn't want to win, it's that he seems determined to

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

utterly dstroy any remaining support for the Labout party.

https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/e678d0fcf64dc99950be0ebc4e532236dcb2dfb5/654_448_543_326/master/543.jpg?w=620&q=85&auto=format&sharp=10&s=0a5eace6526a3ea7f11d4cd9c8d845a2

[Berni]

[Classic Jorge]

I may be being politically naieve but isnt it a harder to sell notion that the PM is intent of driving down our pay and conditions to the point where we can compete with china and india and that we've essentially had zero growth over his entire tenure, meaning in real terms the vast majority of people have had a 6-10pc pay cut?

[Berni]

mean they have to arrange days off to look after their kids and expect guaranteed annual pay rises regardless of the state of the economy.

People f**king hate unions.

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

duffel coats standing around braziers. Outside of the far-left bubble, people expect train drivers, doctors and dustmen to get on with the job.

Your other point doesn't really stand because it is all nonsense and hyperbole, worthy of the Boy Owen.

[Classic Jorge]

Most people would want to be a union member if they could, wouldnt they?

I've been paying my subs for seven years now, even though I've no use for any of it.

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

What's the weather like back there in 1973, j?

[redgunamo]

[Luis Anaconda]

have you not noticed how people over the past 30 years have tended to vote in governments who have it in for unions more than they do for opposition that don't

[Berni]

Which is why the only places they still hold any sway is in the public sector or in monolithic sectors like transport. Most people regard them as an anachronism.

[Classic Jorge]

Remind me again how much growth we've had over the course of the last two governments. Remind me of all of the things this government has done to help the lot of the working people.

[Classic Jorge]

[Berni]

...oh, hang on, they didn't do that at all, did they? Because they liked getting elected and knew that the electorate F.UCKING HATE UNIONS.

[Luis Anaconda]

"Employment was buoyant, reaching a new record with the number of people in work hitting 31.39 million, 74% of the workforce. Inflation remains low at just 0.2%, allowing living standards to continue rising, on average."

From the Guardian btw

[Classic Jorge]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

and I don't expect you to change your mind as a result of my reasoning.

My point was that Corbyn seems to delight in making his party more and more unelectable, which strikes me as amusing.

I have no huge regard for the current government which I consider to be limp-wristed in the extreme, pandering to the leftist media and ducking tough decisions, but the economy has been growing and inflation has been negligible.

[Berni]

Unions are perceived as just being there to bully and blackmail their way to getting more than they're worth.

[Classic Jorge]

...and more people forced into working for their benefits for fear of having their benefits taken away from them entirely on the whim of some jumped up **** who is targeted on the amount of sanctions they can enforce on people.

[Luis Anaconda]

My post was phrased as such for a reason - that party got elected precisely because it clearly distanced itself from the Unions - something you would know doubt admit in a different argument as I know you are not a fan of Mr Blair. The upshot of which was the unions attempting to seize back power in the party and putting their weight behind Miliband -and how did that work out?

[Pokster]

and the BoE sets interest rates to target inflation so hard for the Govt to take massive credit for that

[Luis Anaconda]

on average is the key word there, surely. Or is the Guardian lying to me

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

People forced into working! OH MY GOD I DON'T BELIEVE THE EVIL TORY SCUM EXPECT PEOPLE TO WORK IN EXCHANGE FOR MONEY!

Under The Dear Leader's reign we'll all be able to stay at home watching daytime TV and He will personally come round every day with a big wheelbarrow full of cash and there will be pop and sweets and unicorns hurrah! :cloud9:

[Classic Jorge]

It's worth pointing out that the OBR set bank rates independently of the government. And Gideon has missed more or less every target he's set himself over his entire pisspoor reign, lets not forget that.

[Luis Anaconda]

need to switch mortgages beforehand

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

since inflation has been so low :shrug:

[Pokster]

but a slim chance they could go down first

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

that I disagree fundamentally with many of the actions of this government. I disagree with you not because I 'am a Tory', but because I have eyes with which to see reality and a brain with which to process these visual images.

[Classic Jorge]

The 62 quid people get is to keep them going, it's not a wage, f**k me it's not even a day's wage. You cant force people to work if you arent going to give them a fair wage in exchange.

[Pokster]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

sticking to the point in question? Thank you.

[Classic Jorge]

[Classic Jorge]

You'll be trying to give them credit for OPEC's oil glut next by saying that petrol prices have fallen.

[Luis Anaconda]

If it all goes tits up I shall blame you

[Pokster]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

We're not going to end up with negative interest rates, are we? :-(

[Berni]

and aren't subject to competition for their jobs helping exactly?

I mean the left is always complaining about bankers and bosses being overpaid, but doesn't seem too bothered when it's some bloke with no GCSEs whose job consists of pushing a button for 60k p.a. when he could just as easily be replaced by a computer.

[Classic Jorge]

point taken about the clause four stuff though, and yes in a different argument I would make a different case.

I still think it was a valid point though. Especially given five of those years were in coalition.

[Pokster]

equity markest slumping (China closed this week... they have some catching up to do), growth slowing..... only good poisnt is job creation ... but wages aren't going up that fast so that negates that

[Classic Jorge]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

Don't bother. Bankers... :yawn:

[Classic Jorge]

[Pokster]

which is below wage growth (at the moment)

[Classic Jorge]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

[Pokster]

[Luis Anaconda]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

[Classic Jorge]

CPI replacing RPI and all that.

I'm also aware that these things mentioned have all risen far in excess of economic growth, or would you say that rail fares, utility bills and rents have risen by less than a percentage point over these periods?

[Pokster]

[Berni]

How do unions whose sole aim is to screw as much money as possible out of the public purse help those on low wages in other industries exactly? They don't, do they? They simply ensure there's less to go around. They're saying I''m Alright Jack' and pulling up the ladder the same as anyone.

[Classic Jorge]

****, sorry, yes, that's communism again isnt it?

[Pokster]

all of which are currently below wage growth

[Berni]

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_400/MI0000/043/MI0000043992.jpg?partner=allrovi.com

[Pokster]

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

[Classic Jorge]

But I'm pretty sure it's them

[Sir Charlie of Nicholas]

There can't be further growth in that market... there just can't, it's mental.

[Pokster]

so hard to blame Labour for that one

[Classic Jorge]

Teachers, nurses, policemen, are these all overpaid?

[Classic Jorge]

[Classic Jorge]

[Berni]

sector or got promoted into a nice little earner.

Coppers are definitely overpaid given their qualifications and general intelligence, but we need them, so whaddayagonnado?

As for nurses, it's hard to say. Again, if they're any good, they're in the private sector or climb the ladder quickly. Merely being a nurse doesn't entitle you to a good wage.

[Ashberto]

Your omniscient powers are extensive indeed, if you can now assess the performance of all the teachers and nurses in the land, measured of course against your own advanced skills in teaching and nursing.

If you carry on like this you will have to start believing in god or you will start to doubt your own existence.

[redgunamo]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/20/16/29CEB9C900000578-3132618-Bergkamp_was_named_PFA_Player_of_the_Year_in_1998-a-197_1434813709547.jpg

[eastgermanautos]

[barrybueno]

First thing that sprang to my mind :hehe: