If we were going into our final three league games in the same position as we are in the CL, would

[Monty91]

we not be more optimistic about our chances? We need three results to go our way, two of which you would describe as likely, and the other eminently possible. So in a sense, while understandable, the negativity is disproportionate, imo.

[Pokster]

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

Though perhaps your simplistic and playground analysis of events overlooks that some, perhaps many, look upon qualification to the next phase as ultimately a pointless exercise and to this end are almost subconsciously willing our exit.

The above further muddled by a genuine belief for the first time in maybe a decade that the league is perhaps a viable target.

The sporting elephant in the room being the forced involvement in another tournament, albeit one that we may have more chance of winning.

[Billy Goat Sverige]

[7evens]

Obviously not but hopefully you may begin to grasp the reasons why some fans believe Wenger has his limitations at the very top level.

[Monty91]

Barcelona 0-3 Bayern Munich (Agg: 0-7)

[Classic Jorge]

And in fairness, this is also usually the point in which you bring up what Mourinho wouldve done.

[7evens]

What is this now, the 6th season where we've failed to qualify for the last 16 ?
Our record in this competition is pisspoor.
It's not the losing to Bayern or Barca, it's the poor results against the teams that we're really meant to beat.

[Peter]

Situation. Any hope we had of a title challenge rested on the injury situation improving and so far it seems to have got worse.

There isn't a squad in world football that could win this title with this many injuries. It's impossible. And it is so predictable.....

[Luis Anaconda]

We have made the last 16 for the last gazillion years precisely because we generally do beat teams we are "meant" to beat

[Monty91]

What would it take for you to forgive him? Would winning he league do it?

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

You need to learn to embrace these things.

[Pokster]

a last minute goal... that gives us the option of winning in Greece and being in the CL or losing and being in nothing.



We should aim for EL if we can't get in CL imho

[Monty91]

from the two who'll be missing on Sunday would be guaranteed starters and Debauchy - irrespective of his dodgy form - is a pretty impressive replacement for the latter.

[7evens]

If that really is the benchmark of where we should be satisfied then we have different perspectives of achievement.

[PSRB]

should get a few players back

[Classic Jorge]

[PSRB]

[7evens]

Clearly more than me and I wouldn't actually consider myself a rabid over reactionary type.
The CL record in recent years is a huge indication of a manager who consistently makes the same mistakes.

[Peter]

An eleven with virtually nothing on the bench and everyone has to play 90 minutes of every game. Its storing up problems for later in the season and it is going to start hitting our results pretty soon.

It is f**king laughable that this situation has gone on for so long and as long as it does we will never do any better than third or fourth.

The notion that we have a strong squad is not really supported by what has happened each time we have played them this season. Those performances have been almost exclusively appalling.b

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

Had everybody been fit last night I suggest the starting 11 would definitely have been different in respect of 3 players and maybe 1 other. The narrative of Arsenal missing 6/10 first team players is a little red top tabloid screaming sensation headline.

Every player on the pitch last night with the exception of perhaps Campbell is a recognised Arsenal first team player, this was not a Carling Cup team.

The lack of performance was perhaps disappointing but we came up against one of the very best sides in Europe, capable on their day of doing that to most.

Bayern dominated us in the first half in a way I can’t recall since maybe Deportivo around 2001. In the intervening years when we have played the elite sides we have always managed to eak out the odd foray into their half, for 45 minutes last night we looked incapable of even retaining possession for > 10 seconds.

Still not much has really changed from our CL position of 24 hours ago.

[Monty91]

[Ashberto]

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

[Peter]

The fear is losing one big one- ozil, sanchez, cazorla. Even giroud is important as we have nobody else fit.

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

Finely tuned athletes as opposed to a bald, middle-aged Yorkshire based financial services employee who has probably not seen his toes in a decade.

:-(

[Peter]

Even you have to see that was pure deflection. Those two are part pf a hard core that are almost guaranteed to miss large chunks of every season, along with jack, ox and possibly now wellbeck too.

Seems to be a british problem in the main :rubchin: gibbs also used to be injured a lot when he actually played every week.

[Monty91]

may well not be with us for many more years.

[Peter]

I suppose it gave campbell his chance.

[Classic Jorge]

Ox wouldve played, I'd suggest Welbz too wouldve been on the pitch at some stage.

That makes six.

[Peter]

Losing to complete and utter crap is a new development this season which actually suggests that wenger is finding some new mistakes to add to the old ones :-)

[Monty91]

Gabriel has done well. Theo and Giroud have both done well when called from the bench or played due to injury. Joel Campbell did well last weekend.

Debauchy has obviously struggled while the Ox has been the only other squad player who I’d say has not met expectations so far.

[Ashberto]

There was something like a 6th or 7th choice right winger, and the guy that gave us an outlet against not only Bayern in the home match but against Barca in similar circumstances was out. Having better options from the bench would make a difference too.

Yes, Bayern are awesome, and would usually beat our first XI with a strong bench but four outfield players from ten is still a lot when you have to be at your best to stand a chance.

[Monty91]

austerity years.

[PSRB]

so I expect Cahill to fully clog Giroud :-(

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

The other 3 are definite.

The state of our bench would have brought many a grown man to tears however it was still a very strong 11.

I am issuing you with a :yellowcard: here for being a bit of a fanny.

[Ashberto]

[Classic Jorge]

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02809/Kim-Kallstrom_GI_2809122b.jpg

[Luis Anaconda]

and Ian Bell can f**k right off

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

Haven't we all been waiting to see what the Campbellator can do on a big stage.

Go Joel!

[7evens]

Not something that should be beyond a team of our stature.
Deloitte report every season that we're 7th or 8th in that list of theirs.
I along with most would be happy with a bit more progress. We stumble at the same hurdle every season. It's all getting a bit predictable.
Wenger must hate the CL. It 's there to undermine everything else he achieves.

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

In my professional life I have never been interested in excuses, only solutions.

Never had your card marked as an excuses man.

[Ashberto]

Wenger Out! then.

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

No shame in losing to Munchen.

I expect this is how supporters of most other sides feel after playing us.

[Peter]

The two cl games and the carling cup where several individuals (debuchy, chambers, arteta, ospina) have looked awful as part of an overall dreadful performance .

Does little to suggest that we have a very strong squad. That was the point.

[Peter]

As bad a performance as i have ever seen.

[Ashberto]

I would usually expect us to lose to Bayern whatever the line-up. Perhaps a stronger line up would have given them a bit more of a game. As we did at the Grove.

[Pokster]

marathon runner galore (well, run 1 and doing another next yr), so I can see all my toes thank you very much