So it looks as though Corbyn will be in place just in time to walk into the elephant trap of a vote

[Berni]

on bombing ISIS in Syria. That should be amusing. :hehe:

[Classic Jorge]

....is military action really that popular an option?

[Rich]

[Classic Jorge]

Do you not think it's a bit like using a sledgehammer to crack an atom?

[Ashberto]

[Classic Jorge]

I thought it was a rather nice metaphor

[Berni]

Everyone wants to see us to smash a few beardies up.

Don't get me wrong, I think the reasons for people feeling this way all of a sudden are a bit retarded, but that is the public mood at the moment, yes.

[Rich]

and chat about it?

These people will not be reasoned with, J. If you let them go unchallenged they will strengthen. Them strengthening means a greater risk of terrorists attacks on British soil.

Sadly, there will be civilian casualties. Chiefly because ISIS will hide among innocents so that when the inevitable bombings occur, they can wag the finger at the 'evil' west.

Even Labour are going to back it, anyway. So not sure why we're having this conversation.

[Classic Jorge]

For the record though, I think Corbs is more in favour of a solution that might actually do some good rather than just make us feel better because we've killed some people on a pretty arbitary basis.

[Berni]

and control to the extent that their ability to operate will be severely hampered. We're not going to carpet bomb them or anything.

[Classic Jorge]

My point is, a peacemeal bombing campaign wont go very far to sorting the problem out either, especially a unilateral one.

[Berni]

These people think that what we see as their worst aspects are their best. They sincerely believe they will go to paradise if they die in battle. Their aim is to subjugate everyone to their will - that's it. You can't appease people with those aims and so you cannot negotiate with them. You just have to stop them.

[Classic Jorge]

[Berni]

Basically, the idea of killing naughty muslims is really popular in the west at the moment. Make of that what you will.

[Berni]

[Classic Jorge]

It'll do no good other than satisfying the blood lust of a few morons

[Berni]

It all has to be part of a wider effort to militarily defeat ISIS. There really is no other option.

[Classic Jorge]

[Ashberto]

[Snin]

to imagine that dumb f**ks like you are an allowed a vote is patently ridiculous

you shouldn't be allowed on the internet either

knob jockey

[Classic Jorge]

[Rich]

wiping off the face of the earth.

I know that the majority of muslimmen do not support their actions, but I think Cameron & co said it perfectly when they spoke of the silence from a lot of muslims on the subject. This is what I find most troubling.

[Berni]

extent, in fact, that they became unable to operate without getting the old 'death from above' treatment. That made them be seen as weak and irrelevant, which of course opened the door for ISIS to depose them and pursue its rather more localised aims, but there is no doubt that Al Qaeda was destroyed to a large degree by military means.

[Rich]

idea being that if you cut the head off the snake, it struggles to bite.

What is your peaceful solution? Do tell...

[Classic Jorge]

You can just see him leading a global coalition of those willing to listen to Dave.

"Guys? Guys.......?"

[Classic Jorge]

[Snin]

instead of pretending to help the Syrian ones.. I really do like how bloody retared everyone is on this one..i think its my final hurdle I had to overcome before I agreed to myself that most british people need re-education and shooting tbh..wd polpot!

so we bomb and f**k over Iraq, Syria and Libya..with no society put in place..so helping grow al-quaeda and isis ( after starting the whole thing off in Afghanistan - palestine against Russia with the Taliban and against plo) THEN we let and support Saudi , quatar and turkey to grow isis and give it money and weapons THEN when the locals decide its a bit f**king dangerous so f**k off to Europe we go back to ..BOMBING THINGS ! woo hoo well done us.. f**king retarded cnuts

im with putin on this one..could have been solved years ago by not starting it..and backing it..

if you cant see even a bit of this then you are truly one of lifes sheep and I would feel no hesitation or compassion in slahing your throat tbh

[Berni]

focused organisation in the same way that Al Qaeda was. As such, it represents a less immediate - but nonetheless significant long-term - threat to the west.

[Snin]

[Classic Jorge]

I'm suggesting, rather than doing something that will achieve nothing and inflame the situation more, that it might make sense to actually get together with other people and have a proper multilateral solution. Not one just based around a few bombing raids to make us feel better.

[Snin]

:****er: :dickhead:

[Steve Williams - gay for Mark Knopfler]

Homeland.

[Berni]

sensible discussion here.

[Classic Jorge]

[Snin]

are you going to change your mind from reading awimb ? is Jorge ? nope, is rich spouting ****e ? yes..ill say what I want thanks.. its like politics for kindergarten so ill act like kindergarten.. its total simplistic drivel all round

[Berni]

[Berni]

smear poo around the place like an attention-seeking, ADHD toddler.

Try engaging like an adult.

[Classic Jorge]

[Berni]

you? What? Because they have disagreements over the the EU?

Fortunately, international politics isn't quite as childish as you imagine, j. :hehe:

[Peter]

Or even i will get scared that the silly old lefty could actually win an election.

Looking forward to the eu referendum :-)

[Classic Jorge]

[Berni]

He's going to walk in and immediately reveal how far out of step he is with the electorate and most of his parliamentary party.

The EU referendum will be fun, I agree. For all sides. ;-)

[Berni]

Honestly, j, if you were able to see past your prejudices for a moment, you'd realise how silly you sound.

[Classic Jorge]

[Berni]

[Classic Jorge]

It's not that it cant happen, however unlikely one might think it is, it's just I dont think it will do anything.

What we need is a combined, considered joint military and humanitarian solution. And, unfortunately, whether we like it or not it will require ground troops.

I just dont see it happening without a massive face-off with russia, which nobody seems to want.

[barrybueno]

Have a top up at lunch, get rid of that nasty hangover :thumbup:

That's what I'm gonna do :lager: :cloud9:

[Berni]

country.

Good lord.

[Classic Jorge]

And, seeing as we created this mess in the first place - in so many ways - then that's what's needed.

[Berni]

piece that has been going on pretty much since the fall of Jerusalem to Titus and the destruction of the temple. We did not start Islam and we did not operate the Ottoman empire. This hand-wringing 'it's all the west's fault' thing is so much bull**** and we need to get it out of the way before we do anything.

[Witharby 2-3 weeks]

[Classic Jorge]

Not to mention the reckless attitude towards syria.

And that's just staying within this century

[Ashberto]

attitude from the west as it refuses to acknowledge the consequences of its actions - all the way back to Aghanistan 1.0 and the decision to use radical islam as a geopolitical tool.

[Berni]

Which is what the west did with Saudi and the Mujahideen to defeat Communism. You can't have it both ways, a.

[Berni]

I don't remember us starting the whole Sunni vs Shia thing that's currently playing out to horrific effect, for instance, but I'm sure you'll find a way to blame us.

[Snin]

busy enough burrowing its way up Sir C's arsehole to worry about me insulting dear rich ? and if you think you were having an adult discussion then more fool you tbh

[Berni]

tiresome and it isn't funny. It is infinitely worse than someone like modd, whose input is at least benign and inoffensive, whereas you are just boring and unpleasant.

I hold no brief for Rich. He's his own man. I object to the fact that you target him because you perceive him as being someone you can get away with abusing without incurring any censure - he's a soft target for your unpleasantness. And, as ever, you revert to more unpleasantness when called out for it.

If - as you suggest - you have a so much more nuanced view of these things, why not share it rather than just trying to derail and rubbish everyone else's discussion? Could it actually be because your grasp of these things is actually tenuous to the point of idiocy? Probably based around some moronic conspiracy theory that a child of 12 would reject as unconvincing? Based on your previous forays into the realm of world politics, we must assume as much.