Wenger's mistake was doing so well in the first nine years

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

Had he spread it out over 18 years there'd be less gripping, bitching and complaining. There would however still be those that dislike him intensely and they would still look to undermine and belittle, just as they've done when we were winning things under Wenger. Expect no difference if we win the FA cup.

I actually did a long rant, but for once I'm not posting it on awimb.

I will just ask, over the 18 years
how many clubs have won the PL,
How many have won more trophies total wise, not type,
How many have stayed in the top 4,
Of our nearest competitions how many have dropped out of the PL during that time
How have reached semi finals of our cup competitions more than once?

Also compare those 18 Wenger years with the pre Wenger years.

It makes interesting reading, and shows why It's too easy to simply say we've won nothing for nine years. Just as it was too simplistic to count the red cards under Wenger.

[Eboue's Boutique]

Hope we can get a few decent f**kers in this summer.

f**king horrific luck on Theo & Ramsey being injured by the way...

[afc1]

We were to be honest no more than a better than average club, top 10 usually... often dropping lower... the occasional FA Cup and/or League Cup win.

The chart below says a lot about us pre-Wenger and since Wenger. (From Wikipedia... but I think it is accurate).



http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Arsenal_F.C._league_positions%2C_1947-2013.png

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

No more inbetween nonsense.

[Wembleygooner- raised in hornsey]

He was hardly given donkeys - has the team improved over the last few years ? One of the definitions of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result -

[Nicosia Gooner]

We had to build a stadium and David Dein himself admitted last night that there was no money for Wenger to spent, I repeat, NO MONEY FOR WENGER TO SPENT

This is the first season that Wenger had some money to spend

PLUS

Theo, Ramsey, Jack and Zoil all out for weeks / months - that doesn't help

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

[Bergkamp's Brain]

The rise of the wealthy who have taken over football. The new stadium for Arsenal and the financial implications. Expecting us to be the same club we were before 2004 is expecting far too much. There are some times in that period where the manager/the players/the club have let everyone down. That happened before 2004, but these ones get magnified due to the lack of silverware.

[redgunamo]

[Nicosia Gooner]

forgetting that Wenger rebuilt the team thgat became the invincibles?

The Parlour, Keown and Bergkamp from pre-Wenger

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

Back five to slow, too old etc etc. you forget those comments? Some even said he was mad to keep faith in them.

You also forget that ALL of those players you quoted to a man, credit Wenger with prolonging their carers and sharing a vision with them. Their words not mine. I will take the credit they give over the discredit you give as fact any day given what they produced under Wenger's coaching of them.

[ArseMart - Enjoy every sandwich]

some outpouring of hate which we've all waited 9 years to vent. Most people I know who want him gone have come to the decision slowly and with a great deal of regret.

But we are seeing the same mistakes over and over again. Consistent failure in the transfer market. Substandard players coming in, glaring weaknesses in the squad not addressed, and gambling on the fitness of players in key positions. We could have won another 2 titles bringing in players in January but we didn't.

Consistently out thought tactically by opposition managers. Mourinho has him in his pocket every time.

Consistently poor again big teams. Blown out of the water on numerous occasions.

Consistently collapsing at the business end of the season.

Can you honestly see any of that changing under Wenger?

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

And the Arsenal over time.

Most people can only see what's in front of their face now.

[Wembleygooner- raised in hornsey]

Ye Gods ! What has to happen? Either we are in the elite or we are not - if we are not why build a 60k seater? Do you believe we are one or two players short ? Cos I think we need at least 10 players - we need to embrace the fact that most top teams need a bankroll and managers will be rotated - who thinks moyes is safe and he hasn't been in the job a full season yet

[Nicosia Gooner]

Need two top forwards, plus additional defenders especially at right back if Sagna goes and centre backs as back up to Kos and Per

[Wembleygooner- raised in hornsey]

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

As for being out thought by mourinho, I've not heard any completes when we beat spurs time after time,. I'm not hearing Wenger being credited with out thinking other managers consistently which he does, nor was there moaning when we beat City the season they won the PL but you moan because we've lost against a big team today.

I want him to kick mourinho another one, just as I' relished when we did it to ferguson . But that doesn't make him a bad manager of the Arsenal when he doesn't.

Stop being a sheep and think!

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

In terms of competitiveness,

We would have been better if we'd had a 30 goal a season striker alongside Giroud, in addition to Ramsey and Walcott both fit and playing consistently.

[Nicosia Gooner]

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

Winning trophies does not make you a member of the elite, ask Birmingham , Blackburn, Tottenham and Wigan if you don't believe me.

It's about being consistently at the top table, even if you only get to eat the scraps for a few years,. Apart from which the rules to getting to sit at the elite table change all the time, so if you are still there when the changes happen you're doing something right.

[redgunamo]

Not so ridiculous really :-)

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

[afc1]

Pre Wenger we were not much better than above average.

We were inconsistent. We were in a much loved stadium, but one that was holding us back as a club.

Post Wenger, we are now one of the European football elite, when you start talking about top clubs in Europe who are there and thereabouts consistently every year then in the past people would talk about Barcelona, Real Madrid, the two Milans, Juventus, Bayern Munich and Man Utd we have joined that elite group (along with probably one or two others who have made it on merit such as Borussia Dortmund), and several others who have got there as rich mens playthings or as sovereign investment vehicles (Chelsea, Man City, PSG).

We can now move on and I think my only criticism is that I think Wenger and / or the board do need to invest in more (as in better) cover in key positions. We now have the financial clout to do it.

I still think Wenger has the ability and unless we can land a Guardiola or a Klopp I am happy for him to continue.

[LadyG -keeping the spirit of the unbeatables alive]

I think that if people really stopped and analysed things than just simply reacting to things they will see what is going on, but we live in a world where instant gratification is king in all things including football. We will never have the biggest wad of money or the bottomless pit, so we have to build our survival and competitiveness at the elite table on more than how much we have and can spend.

Now we are out of the debt mire, the board have to free Wenger up to do what he did in the first nine years.

[Nicosia Gooner]

work like that

[redgunamo]