What a load of sentimental tosh gets spouted about Wenger on here at times tsk tsk

[7evens]

Our greatest ever manager. No debate, but to use that as a template for future success is ridicules.

Forget the results against Manure and Chelsea. We all expected that.

Stoke, Norwich, Schalke at home. Fulham, Sunderland... Enough to surely question exactly where we're headed under the bloke.

I get the loyalty thing but come on people ???

We're going backwards and yes, yes, he pulled a rabbit out the bag last year, but to castigate some fans for wondering what the hell is on at the minute is a tad harsh.

He's not the only able manager out there and what should concern is the way we're rolling over in many of the games this year.

A new manager could galvanise a very talented squad of players in a way that perhaps Wenger has forgotten how to http://www.awimb.com/images/smiley_icons/shrug.gif

[Herr Floyd - PEGIDA]

Football is a sport and about fun after all. Its not a game of economics. He is also signing ****ter players than when he first joined> He has lost his mojo. His teams play worse and worse each year and get more and more boring.

[Classic Jorge]

[Monty91]

If anyone is motivated by blind emotion, it's those who want him out.

[7evens]

and too long in the job.
Sometimes people just want a see a new face regardless of the outcome.

The only reason Taggart gets away with it is due to his incredible ability to compete and win things at the highest level.

If you're not ticking those boxes but remaining in the job and being highly paid, then people will begin to question why you continue to be there. and in Wengers case, he's being incredibly well remunerated.

I can't think of many other top European clubs that would accept the same manager for a trophyless eight seasons, without changing things around. A very unique situation.

[7evens]

He's been a wonderful manager and I do think results and performances will improve.
I'm not overly bothered about the silverware aspect but there's a real lack of cohesion about the place these days.
I'm not one of those who gets a weekend ruined by a bad result but I'd quite like to see a new face at the helm.
Hardly a reactionary statement after supporting the bloke after so many years.

[Monty91]

confined to English football only, not least because of the disproportionate influence of fans on the continent (certainly in Spain and Italy, in any case).

In England, how many clubs similar to us in size do you think would have stuck with their manager with the same record as Wenger? And which clubs?

[7evens]

You're only really as good as yesterdays in many walks of life.
Respect but don't dwell too much on the past.
I really do get the loyalty and respect thing but old Alf Ramsey would still be managing England or Billy Nic at Spurs if they weren't ( well, dead mostly ) but you get where I'm coming from.
Every tenure has a natural end point. I just feel he's nearing his and I also hope he doesn't suffer an ignoble end based upon the ignorance of the mob.

[Gunner Since Time Began - born to moan]

[Monty91]

years of champions league football.

Leaving aside the environment in which this has been achieved (stadium move, billionaire funded rivals) how many other English clubs of our standing or similar do you think would have got rid of Wenger with the same 15 year record?

And which clubs?

[Redflag]

they always go for what they believe to be the sensible safe option... Ferguson wouldn't have lasted 8 years at United without winning something... Wenger wouldn't last one season at Real Madrid... where he once claimed he could go ... if producing results like he has done with us over recent seasons... he's bullet-proof at AFC though because the current major shareholder only asks for a profit to be made every season ... Peter Hill Dud is always telling us that Arsene has a degree in economics ... that must come in handy when he's adding up the differentials between selling top players and replacing them with lesser ones.Hardly a case there for putting him up for a business enterprise award.

[Monty91]

has he underachieved. Why is it to irrational to want him to stay?

That we have not won the league since billionaire owners arrived in the game should not skew those simple facts.

[halfsharkalligatorhalfman]

We have become blinded by Wenger's complacency, or what?

I for one think we are incredibly lucky to have a truly world class manager, and it could be a long long time before we see someone of his calibre again.

[Luis Anaconda]

"I'm not really bothered, I've not really put much thought into it but I quite like the grass over there" http://www.awimb.com/images/smiley_icons/shrug.gif

[Redflag]

Jesus wept! Oh the irony.

[halfsharkalligatorhalfman]

And my point was that people tend to be 'blinded' to somethings true qualities by something that is, on the surface at least, positive. Complacency is no such thing.

[7evens]

Tell me about Fulham, Sunderland and Norwich and Schalke at home. The 4-0 first half away at Reading.
If we lose the NLD the smoke clouds are going to gather.

It's the team and the performances against sides that are considered weaker which is the cause of the rumblings.

We're playing well beneath ourselves and that's what he's getting hammered for. More the performances, not the results.

[Luis Anaconda]

and there is a template we should be following http://www.awimb.com/images/smiley_icons/rolleyes.gif

[7evens]

This is football LA, not religion. It's about opinions and each of us with more than a passing interest has one.
Surely, you're not going all elitist on my arse.
I was following them before you and most on here for that matter, were sucking on your mum's matey.

[Redflag]

Can you enlighten us?

[Monty91]

I could equally point to Liverpool and City away.

How about you answer the question, which I've now asked three times. You claimed other clubs would have got rid of Wenger. Now back this up with names.

[7evens]

Factor in the salary and the expectation that goes with that and he would have gone.
Moyes would be the only possible exception but Kenwright has a suffocating budget. He's doing well to hang on to him.

[7evens]

and why many are looking towards change.
Why should teeh notion of change be so terrible to contemplate.

[Luis Anaconda]

What I fear more than anything is that is the vile ignorant mouthy minority get their way such will be their power that no manager will be safe in the job. You only need look at the state of Liverpool, where Hodgson can be hounded out almost before a game is played and playing to the crowd became the way to go - Dalglish, the knee jerk signing etc.

Look at the retarded demands of the black scarf morons and I think my fear are well founded. Away from the ticket pricing issue the most worrying thing is their demands on players which stink of the we want those one, not those ones attitude to the extent that their pathetic march should be led by a straggly haired bloke in a wheelchair.

[Redflag]

You are the one who needs to learn what complacency means... you asked a question and then in the follow on provided the answer. They do say though that unintenional humor is the funniest...

[kilburn_ralph]

Even James Bond needs a change every few years

[redgunamo]

It's always difficult comparing different clubs' behaviour anyway, as they all differ in terms of pp&f expectations.

For instance, Liverpool can do what they like because they've won five European Cups. And so on.

[7evens]

[plastic james]

who hasn't won a trophy, who plays sh.te ugly football, and his biggest achievement is keeping everton in the league, the same everton who has never been relegated from the first division is doing well.

but wenger who has spent less than relegated teams, keeping us in the CL year in year out and provides attacking football is doing a bad job?

[redgunamo]

[Luis Anaconda]

Doesn't always help

[kilburn_ralph]

King ZEBO

[Luis Anaconda]

[kilburn_ralph]

[kilburn_ralph]

Poor Munster http://www.awimb.com/images/smiley_icons/cry.gif

[Redflag]

Wenger with the 4th largest wage bill in the Prem is only doing par for the course.
He's not overachieving by getting 4th place or third occasionally.

[halfsharkalligatorhalfman]

[Luis Anaconda]

Let alone the others missing

[7evens]

for the club to compete at the highest level.
Therefore, they cling on to him and accept their position. Their fans would only consider booting him out if they consistantly finished in the bottom five or six places.

No one said Wenger was doing a bad job btw. The prospect of change isn't built on that foundation.

[Monty91]

and their philosophy seems to be to keep changing the manager because at least it then makes them look like they're trying.

If only our board were that ambitious http://www.awimb.com/images/smiley_icons/rolleyes.gif

[kilburn_ralph]

Just one more fly half please - though I like Flood.

But I am a rugby Gom.

Argies were so impressive.

[Luis Anaconda]

Scottish fly halves normally do well for the Lions, maybe Laidlaw will come through

[plastic james]

4th highest wage bill but not 4th highest transfer kitty. if he had 4th highest wage bill and 4th highest transfer kitty then he would be on par, nothing significant i would agree.

however, we've had the lowest transfer kitty in the premiership for 7 years. we actually have 5 million plus from transfer activities during the last 7 years, even wigan has more net spend. this is why wenger is doing a good job.


arsenal have 13 premiership titles. we did not win 13 premiership titles because we had a manager who spent zero, during all our title winning years we've had our fair share of quality players and we spent our fair share of money, we even broke the english transfer record several times.

so the idea of wenger spending no money yet winning the league is not only unheard of in English football history, it never happened in arsenals history either.

therefore to think a new manager will walk in, with the same budget wenger has and make us champions is based on fantasy.

[No-one knows LESS about Wenger than Myles Palmer]

[7evens]

The highest paid in the league, reportedly and 8 years without winning a sniff, not even a league cup encounter against Birmingham. Presiding over a club with it's worst start to a campaign in 38 years and almost certainly the poorest squad in his tenure with the third or fourth highest wage bill and yet you see no grounds to ponder the idea of change ?

[7evens]

Unfortunatly, I fear the mob may make his mind up for him in the end.

[Monty91]

and see plenty of reason to justify doing so.

I do not claim to know for sure that a change would be for the worse. It may well be for the better. The problem is, no-one knows, and even that fact alone might be considered reason enough to stick with the status quo.

Certainly until more money is available, in any case.

[Monty91]

required for a genuine revolt.

[plastic james]

and you're entitled to that opinion because when the team stagnate i understand some ppl will look at the manager.

however if one looks at the context, you will appreciate the job he is doing, you will understand the stagnation is brought upon him and its very difficult, in fact impossible for a new manager to come i, spend zero and make arsenal champions, its simply not logic, we're competing with 3 teams that collect quality players for fun, if one of them has a bad season the other two will most likely not suffer. we need to compete for some of those quality players to create a fair competition and that requires money

its not like germany where when bayern is of form, any other team can come in and win it.

[kilburn_ralph]

Throw in Samoa and England with the handicap and you've you Arsenal Toasting fund secured

[redgunamo]

[halfsharkalligatorhalfman]

But it sounds like you want change for change's sake, when the brutal reality is that very few managers exist who would be an improvement on who we have right now.

Whoever we get will face a herculean task in trying to beat the financial behomoths in Chelsea, City and United. It will in fact be a herculean task just to match up to what Wenger has achieved in keeping us in the top four.

[redgunamo]

For footballing reasons, I mean.

[Nicosia Gooner]

[willich]

http://www.awimb.com/images/smiley_icons/banghead.gif Arsenal at the moment !

[Stroller]

"A new manager could galvanise a very talented squad of players in a way that perhaps Wenger has forgotten how to"

But the opposite is equally possible. Wenger himself is probably the best example of transforming a declining club (not just team) in the modern times. But there are many more examples out there of change having little effect or making things worse (often after a honeymoon period.

Yes, there may be sentimentality on the one side. But equally blind optimism about change is possibly more dangerous.

[redgunamo]

Just saying.

[Yesterday Once More]

[Stroller]

... but on the basis of results so far (as the poster seems to think)? If we were sitting comfortably in the top 4 and already qualified for the CL would anybody be raising the question?

[Nicosia Gooner]

[redgunamo]

[Stroller]

It could be the start of a fine new era, but it could be another Liverpool ..

[redgunamo]

just as not winning them is.

[Stroller]

[redgunamo]

[7evens]

Not that it would be remarkable in any way if we failed to do so.

[Tornado]

[Stroller]

... if that happens then it's a clear failure to meet the club's stated ambition. Then is the time when they will do something about it. If they share your pessimism then they should start thinking about that, but you can be sure they won't act upon it now.

[redgunamo]

merely that it is highly unusual, in football generally and ignoring financial concerns for a moment, for a manager of a big club to remain in situ for so long without winning a trophy of any kind.

[East Upper for Supper]

And follow the delusional old c**t through his retirement and beyond. In the meantime we can get back to being a football club again. I'd rather we struggle to finish above the bottom half than this sodding boring ground hog season crap. It was more fun in the early eighties when the Arsenal when we were proud and loud and just a great club with great fans. Now we have train spotting raincoated c**ts like Adam and Nick. Embarrassing Wenger worshipping f**kwits whom make knowledge (rip) seem like an ultra.
To end...the Wenger pre Emirates is long gone. What's left is a relic and shell whom the game has passed by many many seasons ago.
Now I'll let the normal f**kwitted obnoxious Wenger protector c**ts like Nick, Adam and halfwit carry on boring for England.

[Nicosia Gooner]

[East Upper for Supper]

****