Can't believe we haven't covered the Grenfell effigy furore.

[Pat Vegas]

I find it odd that burning an effigy of a building on a night based on the tradition of burning an effigy of Catholic fella who plotted to blow kill the king would cause outrage.

[Burney]

The only legitimate question is whether posting that kind of material on social media should be a police matter. I'm open to the argument that it should (in spite of the Pandora's box this would inevitably open), but as you say the hypocritical pearl clutching from people who have doubtless sniggered or made light of tragedies themselves has been utterly hilarious to witness.

I'm not open to that argument at all, I'm afraid. It places the power to make a wholly subjective judgement of what is or isn't 'offensive' and thus requiring of police intervention with individual coppers. That judgement is inevitably determined by factors such the political atmosphere and leanings of that policeman's superiors rather than by legal principle and thus becomes a means of stifling legitimate political expression from the side you arbitrarily decide are 'the bad guys'.

[IUFG]

The only legitimate question is whether posting that kind of material on social media should be a police matter. I'm open to the argument that it should (in spite of the Pandora's box this would inevitably open), but as you say the hypocritical pearl clutching from people who have doubtless sniggered or made light of tragedies themselves has been utterly hilarious to witness.

it shouldn't be a police matter.

in years gone by, it would have been a private 'joke' amongst like-minded vermin, that was never mentioned again after the event.

it just goes to prove that once you post something on the internet, you've lost any control over it and it may come back and bit you squarely on the arse.

[Monty92]

What isn't funny about it, for me, is the effort that they went to make the 'joke'.

A quick quip, about any tragedy, might be humourous. I can agree on that. The joke is in the humourous element not the context of the tragedy.

To go out of your way to make a piss poor Blue Peter version of a tower block then throw it on a fire, then film it while applying 'commentary', then posting it on social media AND then not expecting a backlash?

If I went to all that effort to make a joke about Grenfell and that video was the outcome . . . I doubt I'd win any comedy awards.

I spent hours and hours in my 20s with friends in pubs playing Celebrity Death Pool Betting, fastidiously making lists of which celebrities we think are gonna die over the next year

[IUFG]

I spent hours and hours in my 20s in pubs playing Celebrity Death Pool Betting, fastidiously making lists of which celebrities I think are gonna die over the next year :shrugL

absolutely hilarious, m.

Would you do the same and post it on social media now?

[Burney]

What isn't funny about it, for me, is the effort that they went to make the 'joke'.

A quick quip, about any tragedy, might be humourous. I can agree on that. The joke is in the humourous element not the context of the tragedy.

To go out of your way to make a piss poor Blue Peter version of a tower block then throw it on a fire, then film it while applying 'commentary', then posting it on social media AND then not expecting a backlash?

If I went to all that effort to make a joke about Grenfell and that video was the outcome . . . I doubt I'd win any comedy awards.

They thought it would amuse their mates - and it did. A joke is only good or bad based on the audience for which it is intended.

[IUFG]

I find it odd that burning an effigy of a building on a night based on the tradition of burning an effigy of Catholic fella who plotted to blow kill the king would cause outrage.

completely anachronistic, f.

[Monty92]

I'm not open to that argument at all, I'm afraid. It places the power to make a wholly subjective judgement of what is or isn't 'offensive' and thus requiring of police intervention. That judgement is inevitably determined by the political atmosphere rather than by legal principle and thus becomes a means of stifling legitimate political expression from the side you arbitrarily decide are 'the bad guys'.

Indeed, hence my reference to opening a Pandora's Box.

But there are already crimes relating to public harassment, etc, that require a subjective judgement of what is or isn't offensive. This isn't ideal either, but there's little option other than to make anything that doesn't involve physical violence -or the explicit threat of it - permissable.

[Burney]

I find it odd that burning an effigy of a building on a night based on the tradition of burning an effigy of Catholic fella who plotted to blow kill the king would cause outrage.

Well, yes. But - critically, the catholic was white.

[IUFG]

They thought it would amuse their mates - and it did. A joke is only good or bad based on the audience for which it is intended.

Then keep the joke in that circle of friends? Don't share it with the world