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Thread: Not really sure why everyone's acting all shocked about the AfD gains in Germany.

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter View Post
    Irony in that their attempt to escape from their past has actually recreated it. The problem with wanting to appear to be an open and tolerant country is that most people are not tolerant and dont want their country to be open.
    Hardly surprising. Most people operate on the principle 'what's in it for me?' and if they see no benefit to them from immigration, why would anyone expect them to support it?

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Monty92 View Post
    This is a strange thing to say. The people of Europe have been - and remain in large part - incredibly tolerant of the mass migration that has been imposed on them against their express wishes. They may have objected to it, but they have accepted it with incredibly good grace, which stems from an acknowledgement that the overwhelming people who come here were dealt a shít hand in life and are simply seeking a better one.
    True, actually. The European people certainly can't be faulted on their toleration of mass migration. But there's a big difference between toleration of something and support for it.

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    True, actually. The European people certainly can't be faulted on their toleration of mass migration. But there's a big difference between toleration of something and support for it.
    If only they were less tolerant, things might meaningfully change...

    Actually, what I'm waiting for is for a family affected by a European terrorist attack to contain someone who is engaged with this issue and uses it as a platform to speak out. This could be a game-changer as no-one would accuse someone who has lost a loved one at the hands of an Allan of being a racist bigot.

    It could be like when Sarah Payne's mum became a respected voice on how to deal with *****philes, just because her daughter got nonced off and killed.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    Hardly surprising. Most people operate on the principle 'what's in it for me?' and if they see no benefit to them from immigration, why would anyone expect them to support it?
    Precisely. And when politicians ignore this and do it anyway they leave themselves open to resentment from voters. Our mistake was to do this for decades and then give the buggers a referendum.

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    True, actually. The European people certainly can't be faulted on their toleration of mass migration. But there's a big difference between toleration of something and support for it.
    Happy to rephrase if it helps. The majority of people do not want mass immigration and would be happier, lets be honest, if there was hardly any immigration at all.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter View Post
    Happy to rephrase if it helps. The majority of people do not want mass immigration and would be happier, lets be honest, if there was hardly any immigration at all.
    Absolutely. Polls have shown for decades that there is absolutely not a mandate for mass immigration. However, politicians have kept doing it, with predictable consequences.

    I do wonder why it is that those who have consciously and deliberately ignored legitimate voter concerns for decades now seem so shocked that the voters have turned on them. What did they think would happen? Did they think this can could be kicked down the road forever?

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Burney View Post
    Absolutely. Polls have shown for decades that there is absolutely not a mandate for mass immigration. However, politicians have kept doing it, with predictable consequences.

    I do wonder why it is that those who have consciously and deliberately ignored legitimate voter concerns for decades now seem so shocked that the voters have turned on them. What did they think would happen? Did they think this can could be kicked down the road forever?
    Large numbers of people who only experience the good side of immigration lack empathy with people who experience the more negative side. I have about 6 immigrant neighbours in my small block alone, but they are the good type - all middle class professionals and no Allans (except Mesut). We have lovely ethnic-owned restaurants nearby and all the non-British kids that go to our kids' school are likely to be middle class because of the catchment area.

    Why should immigration bother people like me?

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Monty92 View Post
    Large numbers of people who only experience the good side of immigration lack empathy with people who experience the more negative side. I have about 6 immigrant neighbours in my small block alone, but they are the good type - all middle class professionals and no Allans (except Mesut). We have lovely ethnic-owned restaurants nearby and all the non-British kids that go to our kids' school are likely to be middle class because of the catchment area.

    Why should immigration bother people like me?
    Yes. It's also easy to lose sight of how vastly different London is with regard to immigration to the rest of the country. London is huge, wealthy and can absorb immigrants relatively easily. The rest of the country is very, very different in this regard. And if recent politics has shown us anything, it's that Londoners really do not have a fůcking clue how the rest of the country feels.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Monty92 View Post
    If only they were less tolerant, things might meaningfully change...

    Actually, what I'm waiting for is for a family affected by a European terrorist attack to contain someone who is engaged with this issue and uses it as a platform to speak out. This could be a game-changer as no-one would accuse someone who has lost a loved one at the hands of an Allan of being a racist bigot.

    It could be like when Sarah Payne's mum became a respected voice on how to deal with *****philes, just because her daughter got nonced off and killed.

    Unfortunately, the media will always go towards the bereaved person who bleats on well-meaningly about forgiveness and tolerance. They are seen as saintly, while the sort of person you describe would first be seen a vengeful and vindictive and would eventually be smeared by association with some right-wing group or other and thus discredited. It's how it works.

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Monty92 View Post
    Large numbers of people who only experience the good side of immigration lack empathy with people who experience the more negative side. I have about 6 immigrant neighbours in my small block alone, but they are the good type - all middle class professionals and no Allans (except Mesut). We have lovely ethnic-owned restaurants nearby and all the non-British kids that go to our kids' school are likely to be middle class because of the catchment area.

    Why should immigration bother people like me?
    Isn't there evidence that shows the most virulent anti-immigration protests are in areas where there are few migrants - as in the success of AfD in East Germany where there is very little

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