How long until the first Simon Jenkins piece explaining how we

[Burney]

But the terrifying reality is that such attitudes have become so mainstream, there appears to be no real widespread revulsion at the exposure of these views. They should be polling 6%, for Christ's sake.

But we live in a country where millions have been brought up to hate all outward manifestations of their own nation. People like Jorge are allowed to walk the streets, talking treason without being lynched.

[Sir C]

But we live in a country where millions have been brought up to hate all outward manifestations of their own nation. People like Jorge are allowed to walk the streets, talking treason without being lynched.

It's truly, deeply depressing.

[redgunamo]

But we live in a country where millions have been brought up to hate all outward manifestations of their own nation. People like Jorge are allowed to walk the streets, talking treason without being lynched.

You're of that sort too though, aren't you, supporting Ireland at the rugby and refusing to fly the flag or cheer the England football team and whatnot?

[Burney]

You're of that sort too though, aren't you, supporting Ireland at the rugby and refusing to fly the flag or cheer the England football team and whatnot?

These are piffling, frivolous things, though. It is quite possible to eschew the England football or rugby team while remaining a proud Englishman. Equally, it is possible to have another national sporting allegiance for reasons of ons's ancestry and not be treasonous. Contrary to what Norman Tebbit thinks, sport is a poor indicator of true national allegiance because - well, because it's just sport.

There's a reason everyone took the pîss out of Norman Tebbit for his ludicrously narrow view of nationhood.

[redgunamo]

These are piffling, frivolous things, though. It is quite possible to eschew the England football or rugby team while remaining a proud Englishman. Equally, it is possible to have another national sporting allegiance for reasons of ons's ancestry and not be treasonous. Contrary to what Norman Tebbit thinks, sport is a poor indicator of true national allegiance because - well, because it's just sport.

There's a reason everyone took the pîss out of Norman Tebbit for his ludicrously narrow view of nationhood.

Fair enough, but it surely must've occured to you that that's how it starts. Disallowing, disavowing "outward manifestations of their own nation", especially when it's England, or the English for that matter, plays into their hands.

Anyway, nobody in Henley was taking the piss out of Tebbit.

[Burney]

Fair enough, but it surely must've occured to you that that's how it starts. Disallowing, disavowing "outward manifestations of their own nation", especially when it's England, or the English for that matter, plays into their hands.

Anyway, nobody in Henley was taking the piss out of Tebbit.

In a country that exists as an uncomfortable historical amalgam of four different national identities, trying to define one 'correct' sporting allegiance is always going to be rather tricky, though, don't you think?

[redgunamo]

In a country that exists as an uncomfortable historical amalgam of four different national identities, trying to define one 'correct' sporting allegiance is always going to be rather tricky, though, don't you think?

Not I do not. But I wasn't raised in a "multi-cultural" environment, so why would I

It's not really about "correct" anyway, is it. It's about sentiment, instinct, your gut feeling.

[Burney]

Not I do not. But I wasn't raised in a "multi-cultural" environment, so why would I

It's not really about "correct" anyway, is it. It's about sentiment, instinct, your gut feeling.

Gut instinct is learned, though. i grew up in a house with an Irish father who grew up supporting Ireland at rugby. I therefore supported Ireland. Nothing to do with actual national allegiance (I feel none whatsoever for Ireland), just supporting the same team as your dad.

[redgunamo]

Gut instinct is learned, though. i grew up in a house with an Irish father who grew up supporting Ireland at rugby. I therefore supported Ireland. Nothing to do with actual national allegiance (I feel none whatsoever for Ireland), just supporting the same team as your dad.

Oh , fair enough then, my mistake. I thought you were born and raised in England

[Burney]

Oh , fair enough then, my mistake. I thought you were born and raised in England

I was. So what?