****ing sick of playing these ****s every ****ing year.

[redgunamo]

I think the value of the competition as it stands - to the players and the clubs, is the fact that it is designed to get the best teams to the end, and so winning it is highly prestigious, like seeded major tournaments in other sports. Random big teams knocking each other out early doors might be fun, and might give 2nd rate teams like us a chance of winning it, but will the players give a **** about what is ultimately a weaker tournament?

I'm not sure. If you actually win a tournament, surely you can *always* argue that you were the best team in it, can't you. I don't think players refuse to accept their medals and trophies just because they didn't beat Real Madrid.

The competition itself's the thing, I reckon. We want to win the European Cup and if we only have to play against Swindon Town and Saudi Arabia to do it, then so be it.

[SWv2]

I think the value of the competition as it stands - to the players and the clubs, is the fact that it is designed to get the best teams to the end, and so winning it is highly prestigious, like seeded major tournaments in other sports. Random big teams knocking each other out early doors might be fun, and might give 2nd rate teams like us a chance of winning it, but will the players give a **** about what is ultimately a weaker tournament?

The value of the tournament to the players cannot be denied nor underestimated, it being often cited as the reason why players leave clubs or join clubs.

I think the value to clubs is more financial than prestige overall as I would imagine only a handful have realistic ambitions of winning it each August, some others dream like us, most know they are simply in it to make up numbers and reap the financial benefits thereof.

[redgunamo]

The value of the tournament to the players cannot be denied nor underestimated, it being often cited as the reason why players leave clubs or join clubs.

I think the value to clubs is more financial than prestige overall as I would imagine only a handful have realistic ambitions of winning it each August, some others dream like us, most know they are simply in it to make up numbers and reap the financial benefits thereof.

You don't fancy Leicester City then?