AW's 20 years with us. Your assessment?

[Burney]

I meant that that was the point that was originally debated.

But you're sort of making my point for me. Specifically, that the financial position we ended up in was because of the decisions taken by the manager, it was not something that was forced upon the manager.

Well that depends what you mean by 'forced'. Could he have spent it? Almost certainly. Would other, less scrupulous managers have spent it regardless of the effect of doing so on the welfare of the club (Harry Redknapp, I'm looking at you)? Yes. However, not being that sort of manager and caring deeply about the long-term future of the club and knowing what pressures were operating on it, AW looked at the larger picture and clearly decided it would not be in the best interests of the club if he spent that money.

That's not him being 'forced', it's simply him taking account of the circumstances as he understands them and acting accordingly. In other words, his hands weren't tied, but neither were they entirely free given those other considerations.

[redgunamo]

Amy Lawrence is a Gooner. That's no secret. And an admirer of Arsene's.

I love the man. He gave me a joy in watching the Arsenal which I'd never really had. I enjoyed it when we won but our football was rarely that good.

Circumstances defeated him, as Amy more or less details. The new stadium and the arrival of the oligarchs had unfrtunate timings and rather than challenge Manu for the no. 1 spot we ended up celebrating the fourth place trophies. Desperate bad luck with injuries probably cost us two league titles during the barren patch.

However he is partly responsible for the cross he now bears. In refusing to change his vision and his teams' style we ended up with talentead teams who struggled to compete physically which led to the occasional mauling and was no dount partly responsible for our wretched injuries.

It is sad to see a giant, as he was for the first half of his reign, reduced like Gulliver to being baited by Lilliputians such as the black scarf ****s. For his sake he should have gone several years ago. The Kronke model of ownership means we cannot in the long term compete with more ambitious owners.

It would be great for him to have one last hurrah - another league title at least or (looks very unlikely) a Champions League. The outcome is likelier to be a season where we win nothing or maybe a domestic cup and he either leaves in the summer or (if we win something) is offered an extension to growing choruses of disapproval and a poisonous atmosphere until he either wins something big or is finally persuaded to step aside after a couple of barren seasons.

What about Leicester City?

[redgunamo]

Well that depends what you mean by 'forced'. Could he have spent it? Almost certainly. Would other, less scrupulous managers have spent it regardless of the effect of doing so on the welfare of the club (Harry Redknapp, I'm looking at you)? Yes. However, not being that sort of manager and caring deeply about the long-term future of the club and knowing what pressures were operating on it, AW looked at the larger picture and clearly decided it would not be in the best interests of the club if he spent that money.

That's not him being 'forced', it's simply him taking account of the circumstances as he understands them and acting accordingly. In other words, his hands weren't tied, but neither were they entirely free given those other considerations.

I doubt I'll ever forgive Him for encouraging football supporters to think more about money than they do about the game itself. In fact, even thinking about the game itself is bad enough.

Otherwise, I think He's done alright.

[SWv2]

What about Leicester City?

Leicester City could be seen as a blot on the copybook of every manager in the Premier League so as such we prefer to simply ignore them and let them return quietly to whence they came.

[redgunamo]

Leicester City could be seen as a blot on the copybook of every manager in the Premier League so as such we prefer to simply ignore them and let them return quietly to whence they came.

Indeed. They did expose alot of their bull.

And Wenger seemed to talk more b than most, possibly because He does it in a French accent.

[World's End Stella]

Leicester City could be seen as a blot on the copybook of every manager in the Premier League so as such we prefer to simply ignore them and let them return quietly to whence they came.

How about Arsenal from 96-05? 3 league titles and 4 FA Cups while competing against a club with far more resources. Which sort of proved that provided you made the right footballing decisions, you could compete with a much wealthier club.

[redgunamo]

How about Arsenal from 96-05? 3 league titles and 4 FA Cups while competing against a club with far more resources. Which sort of proved that provided you made the right footballing decisions, you could compete with a much wealthier club.

I agree with you 100%, the money-thing was always a McGuffin. But we needn't be too harsh on Wenger over it because that's just football. Not winning is as much part of the game as winning.

[Lar d'Arse]

How about Arsenal from 96-05? 3 league titles and 4 FA Cups while competing against a club with far more resources. Which sort of proved that provided you made the right footballing decisions, you could compete with a much wealthier club.

Totally disagree with that. 96-05 was a period where if you managed to be ahead of Manchester United you were likely to win the League. 03 was it(?) when Abramovich bought Chelsea (who were about to do a Leeds) and the English football landscape changed forever.

That Wenger managed to keep us competitive throughout the period even if the trophy haul dried up somewhat is something to be marvelled at.

Wenger has always said that he will only spend money on players if he thinks they are worth it and will add to the squad. I think it's fair to say that none of us (even those experienced in finance) have the slightest clue about what financial constraints the club was or is under. It isn't just money that determines whether a player comes or goes (or stays) and I include wages as well as transfer fees in that. For some that is a big factor (convinced Nasri eg went for the dosh at Citeh) - for others not so much (Fabregas probably a decent example - he never hid his desire to go to Barca).

I look at the Wenger era very simply. Did he win trophies? Yes and more than any other manager we have had. Have I enjoyed the ride? You bet. Will he leave the club a better club than it was when he arrived? Undoubtedly. Have there been ups and downs along the way? Of course, welcome to the world of being a football fan.

Happy Anniversary Arsene and thank you!