So I've only paid a small amount of attention to all this Brexit nonsense

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Originally Posted by Monty92

Nothing at all. But I'n not sure I favour a referendum about it (maybe I do, I haven't really thought about it).

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I don't feel strongly enough about it to advocate a referendum, but wouldn't object if there were one.

I certainly think it's preferable that we get to decide on it rather than have that decision taken out of our hands by EU diktat (which is currently the case).

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Originally Posted by Monty92

I'm just wondering if there's any limits to the extent that you believe the greater number should exercise greater power?

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Personally, I don't believe in universal suffrage. People under 30, poor people, women, jews, these people have no judgement and allowing them to vote in important matters is madness. But then I don't pretend to be some sort of hand-wringing liberal democrat. :shrug:

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Originally Posted by Burney

There are lots of things wrong with the tyranny of the majority, but it still remains preferable to the tyranny of the minority.

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I am not so sure about that. Particularly if the tyrannical minority is advocating violent overthrow of the existing state. A minority advocating this is my preference.

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Originally Posted by Pokster

???? What the hell are you on about

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Who wrote this? "So basically well done to the idiot that decided giving the population this vote was a good idea"?

Clue: you did.

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Originally Posted by eastgermanautos

I am not so sure about that. Particularly if the tyrannical minority is advocating violent overthrow of the existing state. A minority advocating this is my preference.

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Fine. If you openly advocate authoritarianism and the totalitarian crushing of the individual will, good luck to you (not really - I hope you get thrown out of a helicopter as you richly deserve).
However, this argument assumes that most people in general believe liberal democracy to be a good idea.

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Originally Posted by Sir C

Who wrote this? "So basically well done to the idiot that decided giving the population this vote was a good idea"?

Clue: you did.

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The vote was a complete cock up, you end up with a leave vote and then the final outcome is so fudged that practically everyone in the country doesn't like it... so well done to DC for having such a black and white vote when 1 side had an infinite amount of options so you were guaranteed to piss people off.

And if you put things in speach marks isn't that meant to be a direct quote, not you just making it uip for the sake of it??

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Originally Posted by Burney

I would have no democratic issue with that. However, that is not what is going to happen. The government has in effect ignored the vote to leave and repeatedly lied that we were to leave the SM, CU and the jurisdiction of the ECJ. In defiance of its democratic mandate as defined by its manifesto, the government has not negotiated a Brexit in any meaningful sense. It has effectively signed up to a deal whereby we remain on vastly less favourable terms, in return for which we see an end to FOM. That deal leaves us effectively impotent in any negotiations on a future relationship.

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I'm not sure how you can possibly say that given that we haven't even begun to negotiate the future relationship in any detail? :shrug:

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Originally Posted by Sir C

So... because you are so superior to hoi polloi, you should be allowed to decide which matters they get to have a say in?

My word, you're a very special person indeed. Please may I touch you?

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his winkie c. His flapless winkie man! Can you imagine anything more deeply repugnant?

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Originally Posted by Burney

Fine. If you openly advocate authoritarianism and the totalitarian crushing of the individual will, good luck to you (not really - I hope you get thrown out of a helicopter as you richly deserve).
However, this argument assumes that most people in general believe liberal democracy to be a good idea.

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Even as there is, in all the ancient books, a before and an after, an egg and a chicken, a formless void and then its division into night and day, so must there first be liberal democracy before me and my friends take over. Then watch out!!